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Picture Of The Month



SD2OR with a trophy fall walleye

Topic: Fuse your fishfinder  (Read 22043 times)

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Martial Mathers

  • Herring
  • **
  • Location: Portland OR
  • Date Registered: Jul 2009
  • Posts: 24
I was getting ready to launch off the beach on Sauvie's early Sunday morning to anchor up in 50' and try for a King.  Fortunately I left my hatch open after plugging the ff into a fully charged, 12VDC, 7ah battery.  I was tying up my rig and saw smoke coming from the hatch.  I first thought it was was steam from warm air in the hatch meeting the cool morning air.  I waved my hand over the hatch and it was like an oven.  I reached in and burnt my hand. Luckily, my wits stayed with me.  I immediately grabbed the battery by its base, brought it on deck, and disconnected the ff from the terminals with a Leatherman.  My kayak is alright, but the casing on the power cable melted from the battery almost all the way to the head unit.  This is troubling because, if I had closed the hatch; it's very likely that it would have quietly burned a hole through my hull and sunk me in 50'.  I would have needed a powerboat rescue, and become a running joke on ifish.  What happened is a total mystery to me.  I'm fairly experienced with low voltage wiring and devices.  No, the leads weren't crossed, and that wouldn't have done this anyway, there's a diode in the ff.  Anyway, fuse your fishfinders for safety.  That's what I'm going to do (if it still works).  Humminbird is sending me a new power cable, so we'll see if I get a display again.
Unending Love, Amazing Grace


Kyle M

  • Salmon
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  • Location: Portland, Oregon
  • Date Registered: Jan 2012
  • Posts: 952
Sorry to hear about your meltdown.  I'm sure you weren't entirely literal on your rescue comment.  But in case you were, let's agree that most of us are fully capable of swimming to shore in that part of the river.  I think it's important that we as kayak fishermen assume we'll perform self rescue in most situations.  We should always promote that we are an asset on the water, rather than a liability.  Sorry, I don't mean to hijack your thread.  Now back to that battery....  I wonder why it didn't just fry your ff?  Must have been a short somewhere.


Lee

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  • Location: Graham, WA
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Can a mod sticky this and/or the other one?   Seems to be a continuing issue, and also one that many people think can't happen.
 


Martial Mathers

  • Herring
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  • Location: Portland OR
  • Date Registered: Jul 2009
  • Posts: 24
Sorry to hear about your meltdown.  I'm sure you weren't entirely literal on your rescue comment.  But in case you were, let's agree that most of us are fully capable of swimming to shore in that part of the river.  I think it's important that we as kayak fishermen assume we'll perform self rescue in most situations.  We should always promote that we are an asset on the water, rather than a liability.  Sorry, I don't mean to hijack your thread.  Now back to that battery....  I wonder why it didn't just fry your ff?  Must have been a short somewhere.
I wouldn't have been in danger.  I'd have a pfd on, and am quite capable of swimming to shore, especially in 70degree water.  I just meant with all the boats around, someone would have scooped me up and had a good laugh about it.  I don't know what part of electrical theory explains what happened, but it think it was caused by condensation in the plug part of the power cable (that plugs into the fishfinder).  I'm going to reread the other post about a fishfinder fire.  I wonder if that was also a hummingbird.
Unending Love, Amazing Grace


Mojo Jojo

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Never done marine electronics but fuse everything added on a car. Lawrence Mark 4 dsi 12v 7a batterie , what size inline fuse ? I was thinking 10 amp. All input appreciated.



Shannon
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polepole

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Never done marine electronics but fuse everything added on a car. Lawrence Mark 4 dsi 12v 7a batterie , what size inline fuse ? I was thinking 10 amp. All input appreciated.

I use 5.   You need to think about what the safe rating of your wires is.  The recommended "Maximum amps for power transmission' for 14 gauge wire is like 5.9A.

-Allen


Martial Mathers

  • Herring
  • **
  • Location: Portland OR
  • Date Registered: Jul 2009
  • Posts: 24
Humminbird lists a 1 amp fuse for my fishfinder.  That's probably sufficient for most other FF models.  The power cable it came with looked like 22AWG which is only rated for maximum 3.7 amps.  I'm still plexed by what happened.  In theory a device should never draw more current than it needs.  A device that requires less than 1 amp, shouldn't pull enough current to turn red hot, and melt the PVC casing off its wires (even if the connectors get damp).  This is a factory plug that runs from the head unit straight to the battery.  There is no way to mess it up.  Reverse polarity is the only possible error, and there's a diode to counter that.  I've already PM'd Smokeyangler; I'm very curious if his unit that burned up is also a Humminbird.
Unending Love, Amazing Grace


Mojo Jojo

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I have some 2.5 amp I will start with if it blows I will put in a 5 amp and always carry spares. Thanks for the info.



Shannon
2013 Jackson Big Tuna "Aircraft Carrier"
2011 Native Mariner Propel "My pickup truck"
2015 Native Slayer Propel "TLW's ride"
20?? Cobra Fish-N-Dive “10yo grandson’s”
20?? Emotion Sparky “5 yr old granddaughter’s”


Dirk1730

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  • Date Registered: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 306
Never done marine electronics but fuse everything added on a car. Lawrence Mark 4 dsi 12v 7a batterie , what size inline fuse ? I was thinking 10 amp. All input appreciated.

I use 5.   You need to think about what the safe rating of your wires is.  The recommended "Maximum amps for power transmission' for 14 gauge wire is like 5.9A.

-Allen
How do you keep your fuse from oxidizing going out in the salt and all. Everytime I put one in it lasts one or two days of fishing on the salt. Then in frustration I take it out.
BETTER TO HAVE A BROKEN BONE, THAN A BROKEN SPIRIT.


  • Location: Hood River
  • Date Registered: Oct 2009
  • Posts: 399
Dirk1730.....This style fuse holder will prevent oxidation   http://www.wiringproducts.com/atm-mini-waterproof-fuse-holder-16-ga-wire.html
You can find these at most auto parts stores too.


sherminator

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  • Date Registered: Jul 2011
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In theory a device should never draw more current than it needs.  A device that requires less than 1 amp, shouldn't pull enough current to turn red hot, and melt the PVC casing off its wires (even if the connectors get damp). 

It's not theory - it is a fact that the current draw is inversely proportional to the resistance of the load. What happened is that the resistance became greatly reduced, commonly called a short circuit. Check all the connectors. Sometimes a crack develops between poles and gets water or some other conductive crap in the crack. I used to work in a welding shop and the plugs there would get metal dust in the cracks and cause some poor welder to poop his pants when the plug blew up.

I use 5.   You need to think about what the safe rating of your wires is.  The recommended "Maximum amps for power transmission' for 14 gauge wire is like 5.9A.

-Allen

That current rating is ultra conservative, although I did see it listed in one table. A 14 gauge wire will safely conduct at least twice that, although that is not the point. The point is that you fuse for the load - two to three times the max current is good. I fuse my FF at 2A.
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rawkfish

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Most fuses are designed to open and clear the current through a system when that current of the system exceeds roughly 1.4 to 1.5 times the rated current value of that fuse. With a circuit such as a depth finder, you do not want the current to go too much more than the rated current for the depth finder, which is listed in the manual. Any current value that will cause an appropriately matched fuse to open in your electrical system indicates that there is a problem with your system and you don't want that system to operate anyway until the problem is identified.

My depth finder operates at about 650 mA. I have used a 500 mA fuse with it and it works just fine. I have also used a 1 A fuse and that works too, but the idea of more than an amp running through my system is enough to make me nervous. 500 mA fuses are kind of tough to find in stores. I have found them more often in the tubular form of fuses, so that is the type of fuse holder I use. I use the ones that say they are rated for marine use. They have a rubber casing.  To keep them from corroding I squirt dielectric grease into the fuse holder before I put the fuse in, then wrap it in a few wraps of electrical tape after closing it up. That works really well.

                
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"Fishing relaxes me.  It's like yoga except I still get to kill something."  - Ron Swanson


polepole

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I have also used a 1 A fuse and that works too, but the idea of more than an amp running through my system is enough to make me nervous.

Why does it make you nervous?  Plenty of FF's draw 1A or more through the same power cables and generate negligible heat.

-Allen


Skidplate

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  • Location: Gresham, OR
  • Date Registered: Mar 2012
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500 mA fuses are kind of tough to find in stores.
Have you checked out any online sources? I know McMaster has <1A fuse and I just quickly saw a couple options in the 630 - 800 mA range on Radio Shack's site (probably won't find it in their stores). I bet Graybar, Platt or even Fry's would have them locally though. I agree with you and might also downgrade if I had a high-end unit. I currently run a 1A and feel fine with it for my cheap unit.

Martial - I would look on the cables and find where the burn ends. Since you stated that it didn't make it all the way to the unit, I'm guessing that there was some kind of internal short. That short is probably near where the burn ends. Is that part of the cable near anything that could have pinched it? Say like a hatch or a through hull fitting, zip tie, etc...?
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rawkfish

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I have also used a 1 A fuse and that works too, but the idea of more than an amp running through my system is enough to make me nervous.

Why does it make you nervous?  Plenty of FF's draw 1A or more through the same power cables and generate negligible heat.

-Allen
I say that given what my ff normally draws. If it was rated at an amp or so, that much current wouldn't bother me but two amps would.
                
2011 Angler Of The Year
1st Place 2011 PDX Bass Yakin' Classic
"Fishing relaxes me.  It's like yoga except I still get to kill something."  - Ron Swanson


 

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