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SD2OR with a trophy fall walleye

Topic: Down Imaging Fishfinders in Kayak?  (Read 10494 times)

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Yarjammer

  • Salmon
  • ******
  • Captain of the Titanic
  • Location: Woodinville, Wa.
  • Date Registered: May 2008
  • Posts: 910
I've never really relied on the fish finder to find actual fish as the species I prefer can be located based on the structure.  Bass, panfish, catfish, halibut, and ling cod have preferred habitats unlike their salmonid cousins that generally tend to occupy the unobstructed portion of the water column.  Some people have an eye for reading the images on a traditional sonar... I don't.  On my Cuda 168 and HB Matrix 17 I could never truly make out the difference between rocks and salad.  Supposedly the DI also has the ability to depict where the thermocline is which would be a boon here in the northwest for nearly year-round fishermen. 

I want to believe that DI will be akin to my putting on glasses in the morning.  I can survive without them, but I am much more efficient and productive with 'em.


kallitype

  • Sturgeon
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  • Vashon Island kayaker
  • Location: Vashon Island, WA
  • Date Registered: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 1673
I thought long and hard about this, I have (On my 15' Arima) a Humminbird Matrix 97 which is a fantastic combo sonar/GPS, was about $600 a few years back.  For the yak, I needed a combo unit that was $400 or less, went with a Lowrance color combo, nice but no Si or DI.  I find the ability to find salmonids at 150-250 feet a real plus, the DI and SI really come into their own in shallower freshwater lakes, like 30-60 feet.  I don't think there's much utility for SI in the salt, Di is a maybe/maybe not.   If I were a lake fisherman interested in trout and bass, I'd have SI.
Never underestimate the ability of our policymakers to fail to devise and implement intelligent policy


demonick

  • Sturgeon
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  • Domenick Venezia, Author
  • Date Registered: Apr 2009
  • Posts: 2835
The effective depth for getting the most from the down imaging is ~15'-200'.  Supposedly its horrible for shallow (who cares?) and has a sweet spot between 30'-150' where you get the best returns.

So, I believe what is being said here is that, in the salt the SI/DI will only help in seeing structure in the WA state legal bottom fish fishing zone.  Does the SI/DI NOT see fish?
demonick
Author, Linc Malloy Legacies -- Action/Adventure/Thrillers
2021 Chanticleer Finalist - Global Thriller Series & High Stakes Fiction
Rip City Legacy, Book 6 latest release!
DomenickVenezia.com


Yarjammer

  • Salmon
  • ******
  • Captain of the Titanic
  • Location: Woodinville, Wa.
  • Date Registered: May 2008
  • Posts: 910
Depending on the sensitivity settings and your appreciation for abstract art, you can get some incredible readings of both structure and fish.  I found this site on a random Google search and I've been amazed at the treasure trove of Humminbird data: http://www.bbcboards.net/zerothread?id=652357

This is an interesting thread as well: http://www.bbcboards.net/zerothread?cmd=print&id=493214 (Keep in mind, this was written prior to the 2011 HB model year where DI only became available on the 500 series HB's)

At this point I am unsure about the effectiveness of DI on a kayak due to its exaggerated hull motion relative to a larger boat of similar length and screen size limitations. :-\
« Last Edit: June 10, 2011, 11:32:01 AM by Yarjammer »


Lee

  • Iris
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  • Fuck Cancer!
  • Location: Graham, WA
  • Date Registered: Jul 2009
  • Posts: 6091
Does the DI have the ability to work as a normal FF as well?
 


Yarjammer

  • Salmon
  • ******
  • Captain of the Titanic
  • Location: Woodinville, Wa.
  • Date Registered: May 2008
  • Posts: 910
The Humminbord units have a the standard 83/200 in addition to the DI; Lowrance does not for the non-HDS models. 


kallitype

  • Sturgeon
  • *******
  • Vashon Island kayaker
  • Location: Vashon Island, WA
  • Date Registered: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 1673
Here's the 570 DI, about $300---no 83kh,  but the 200kh for the standard sonar is preferable to 80 or 83, in terms of depth capability and cone angle--for me, YMMV.

Features:
Monochrome 5" 640x320 display
455/800 kHz Down-Imaging sonar and 200 kHz down-beam sonar
800ft depth capability, 2000 Watts PtP
custom View Selections
Quick-Disconnect mounting system
Product Description
Timber, rocks, or even fish--watch it all take shape on crystal-clear, full-color 5" displays. With screens that size, it's easy to take advantage of versatile Down Imaging Sonar and exclusive Humminbird SwitchFire technology. We're talki
Never underestimate the ability of our policymakers to fail to devise and implement intelligent policy


[WR]

  • Sturgeon
  • *******
  • VFW, Life Member at Large, since 1997.
  • ADTA.org
  • Location: West of Auburn, East of the Sound
  • Date Registered: Jan 2008
  • Posts: 4716
Yar,
I'm using the 788C dual beam plus. W/GPS. so far it's been great. it's not DI, but having used it on Rapjon Lake, Silver Lake, Nisqually Delta and Chambers Creek area of Puget Sound, i've been more than happy with the results. yes it's a bit expensive for most kayak fishing, but the large color screen and the ability to navigate via GPS has paid off twice for me on the Nisqually system.

i really am starting to think that DI and SI should be left for the bass boat/ fishing guide set. with dual beam, i get a heck of a lot of information and really good bottom contour/structure information, probably far more information than i really need if i want to be honest. It just depends on what menus i choose.

 From what i've read of DI and SI, i'm not sure it fits in well with our multi water styles of fishing. In fact it may be downright confusing for you in some cases, like going onto the salt at Neah Bay after having used it so much at Potholes and Beaver Lake.

remember, this is just my opinon from limited time use of what i've got. and thanks for those links. i'm learning a lot from them.

BTW, heres a Humminbird online list for Dual Beams if you want an alternative or just want to upgrade to a better unit. and yeh i know what you have is probably dual beam already.

 http://store.humminbird.com/search?&n=0&va=t&q=DualBeam&t=products
« Last Edit: June 10, 2011, 04:39:37 PM by [WR] »
Why so many odd typos ? You try typing on 6 mm virtual keys with 26 mm thumbs....


[WR]

  • Sturgeon
  • *******
  • VFW, Life Member at Large, since 1997.
  • ADTA.org
  • Location: West of Auburn, East of the Sound
  • Date Registered: Jan 2008
  • Posts: 4716
Amos,
Beckyit? Whadjagit?
Why so many odd typos ? You try typing on 6 mm virtual keys with 26 mm thumbs....


Yarjammer

  • Salmon
  • ******
  • Captain of the Titanic
  • Location: Woodinville, Wa.
  • Date Registered: May 2008
  • Posts: 910
After confirming my concerns about DI with two different people at Cabelas this afternoon I picked up a HB 597ci HD.  A big thanks to Demonick for letting me use his scupper transducer!


demonick

  • Sturgeon
  • *******
  • Domenick Venezia, Author
  • Date Registered: Apr 2009
  • Posts: 2835
After confirming my concerns about DI with two different people at Cabelas this afternoon I picked up a HB 597ci HD.  A big thanks to Demonick for letting me use his scupper transducer!

Do our WA contingent proud at ORC!
demonick
Author, Linc Malloy Legacies -- Action/Adventure/Thrillers
2021 Chanticleer Finalist - Global Thriller Series & High Stakes Fiction
Rip City Legacy, Book 6 latest release!
DomenickVenezia.com


Fungunnin

  • Sturgeon
  • *******
  • Date Registered: Aug 2010
  • Posts: 2548
After confirming my concerns about DI with two different people at Cabelas this afternoon I picked up a HB 597ci HD.  A big thanks to Demonick for letting me use his scupper transducer!

I picked up a 597ci HD at Cabela's two weeks ago for a steal! It was missing the mounting bracket and the power cable and marked down $200! ORC will be it's maiden voyage too. Can't wait...


polepole

  • Administrator
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  • Location: San Jose, CA :(
  • Date Registered: Apr 2006
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One thing you need to consider is if the down imaging will work well shooting through the plastic.  Down imaging is a much more precision technology than simple sonar.  Since Humminbird and Ocean Kayak are both owned by Johnson Outdoors I suspect they could answer the question for you.

I've been wondering about that, but I think I would mount it in one of the scupper hole cavities (similar to the 'bird scupper transducer) and marine goop it in place after cutting off/trimming the mounting tang.  The scupper should still be able to flow water around it.  I imagine it would work through the poly, I just want to maximize its potential if I'm dropping that kind of money on it.

Humminbird DI transducer:



The effective depth for getting the most from the down imaging is ~15'-200'.  Supposedly its horrible for shallow (who cares?) and has a sweet spot between 30'-150' where you get the best returns.

When I went to install my 597ci HD DI, I found that the transducer does NOT fit in the Ultra scupper hole mount (or the T13 scupper hole mount).  Looks like I'll have to mount inside the kayak.  I talked to Humminbird and they said there should not be any problems with that.  I was concerned about the possibility of the poly/epoxy perturbing the DI signal.

BTW, Humminbird's recommended procedure is to use a slow curing 2 part epoxy, the main concern being bubbles and that fast curing tends to be too brittle.

-Allen


 

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