NorthWest Kayak Anglers
Regional Discussions => Idaho Kayak Fishing => Topic started by: Idaho Brit on July 27, 2016, 12:45:40 PM
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Anyone up for self rescue practice before the water temp drops? It is important to practice this with the yak you use most, which I found out the hard way this March. There are some good places to practice on Lake Coeur d' Alene. Comments?
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I'm up for it. Let me know when you are thinking about doing it.
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I'm up for it. Let me know when you are thinking about doing it.
Great Honu. I only posted today. Lets give it a bit longer to see who else is interested. Ill keep you posted. When do you normally get on the water?
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I'm working the swing shift, 4pm- midnight, next couple of weeks. So mornings free and all day free Friday, Saturday.
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I'm working the swing shift, 4pm- midnight, next couple of weeks. So mornings free and all day free Friday, Saturday.
Cool, I'll keep you posted.
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Location: Lake Coeur d, Alene. Thursday 9am. Put in at Higgens Point boat launch at the end of East Coeur d' Alene Lake Drive. Just along the bank to the east of the launch is a small beach area with enough drop off to get the depth we need to practice but still be within a safe distance from the beach. If you are interested PM me. Disclaimer. I am a novice kayaker but did some self rescue practice last summer. I have since got a bigger heavier kayak and need to do this practice drill. It is always best to do this in company for safety reasons. Required items include PFD, cold water wear if you have it, no cotton clothing, "leash it or loose it," leash everything especially paddle and Mirage drive. Your kayak should be loaded the way you would normally use it. If you are comfortable with this. If not just bare bones is ok too. Don't forget dry clothes for after your swim.
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If the CD'A salmon derby is still going on parking at the ramp might be zero. It is a dirt ramp with maybe parking for three or four trucks with trailers, During the week it might be OK but if on a weekend finding a spot could be tough...On the bright side, some good smallie fish just west of the ramp.... warf
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If the CD'A salmon derby is still going on parking at the ramp might be zero. It is a dirt ramp with maybe parking for three or four trucks with trailers, During the week it might be OK but if on a weekend finding a spot could be tough...On the bright side, some good smallie fish just west of the ramp.... warf
Thanks for the heads up Warf. The derby ends on Sunday 31st so we should be ok for Thursday 4th Aug.
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I did a drive by yesterday and the ramp looks paved with what seems to be lots of gravel parking between walking path and road. Was I at the wrong ramp? Seems the ramp looked about a 1/4 to 1/2 mile from the end of the road turnaround.
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I did a drive by yesterday and the ramp looks paved with what seems to be lots of gravel parking between walking path and road. Was I at the wrong ramp? Seems the ramp looked about a 1/4 to 1/2 mile from the end of the road turnaround.
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I'm not sure Scott. Here is a link with a photo. The launch is right at the end just before the large car park. I usually launch and then park on the shoulder on the far side of the road opposite the entrance for the launch. As you look down the ramp there is a small area on the left where you can launch your kayak and be out of the way of bigger boats. I will look out for you. I hope this helps. Let me know. Also if you get held up and are late go ahead and launch. We will be halfway between the ramp and the point to the east of the ramp.
https://www.lakecoeurdalene.com/on-the-water/boat-launches/higgens-point-boat-launch/ (https://www.lakecoeurdalene.com/on-the-water/boat-launches/higgens-point-boat-launch/)
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Yup, that's where I was. I needed to verify a head of time as it a little over an hour for me plus whatever time the boat inspection takes along I-90.
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Ok, thanks Tony. Noticed the all boats inspection driving into Cda yesterday. Now need to leave a bit earlier.
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Oop's!!! my bad, I got my ramps mixed up, I was referring to the dirt ramp at Harlow point. Just to many ramps to keep track of!..lol..
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Oop's!!! my bad, I got my ramps mixed up, I was referring to the dirt ramp at Harlow point. Just to many ramps to keep track of!..lol..
I know, right?
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Location: Lake Coeur d, Alene. Thursday 9am. Put in at Higgens Point boat launch at the end of East Coeur d' Alene Lake Drive. Just along the bank to the east of the launch is a small beach area with enough drop off to get the depth we need to practice but still be within a safe distance from the beach. If you are interested PM me. Disclaimer. I am a novice kayaker but did some self rescue practice last summer. I have since got a bigger heavier kayak and need to do this practice drill. It is always best to do this in company for safety reasons. Required items include PFD, cold water wear if you have it, no cotton clothing, "leash it or loose it," leash everything especially paddle and Mirage drive. Your kayak should be loaded the way you would normally use it. If you are comfortable with this. If not just bare bones is ok too. Don't forget dry clothes for after your swim.
just a shout out from the Oregon Coast to everyone doing self recovery practice. Whether you kayak in lakes, rivers, tidewater, or the ocean, having done some practice getting back in your boat will give you confidence to do it like a pro when it really matters...cheers, roger
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Had a great Thursday morning on Lake Coeur d’ Alene with ReelMcCoy and Honu for self rescue practice. I strongly recommend getting some of this practice, especially while the water is reasonably warm. We were able to improve some of our weaknesses and techniques. It can be an eye opener as it was for me. Which is the best reason to do this, rather than be complacent about your abilities, only to find out when you need these skills in an emergency, that you are not as skilled or strong as you thought you were. I have a 2015 Hobie Outback with lot of gear, on an already heavy, wide kayak. I had anticipated the difficulty of righting this upturned boat and installed stirrups on each handle to aid in turning the boat back over. This proved to be very effective. Not having practiced this drill on this boat before, I was taken by surprise by the high freeboard. Although I have extensively studied re-entry techniques and understand what is required to get back in the boat. The height of the boat off the water combined with my age and level of fitness proved to be way more problematic than I had anticipated. What I also found out was that I could only re-enter the boat with a buddy assist, doing a “parallel park” technique. So what I took home from our session was that I need to improve my fitness, loose some weight and develop some mechanical assists to enable effective re-entry. Again I say, “don’t be complacent or overly confident." Practice makes perfect. Thank you Reel and Honu for your participation and help.
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I found out that I,m not good at this, working at it is the most important thing for your safety on the water.
:o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRuZqQH1_DM
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When getting back into your kayak, fast and simple is better than slow and complicated. The guys in yellow kayaks in your video have the right idea. If your kayak gets flipped over, flip it back upright in the direction it came from (so you won't wrap leashes and fishing line around the hull), grab the gunwale with both hands, kick your feet so you're lying horizontally in the water, pull the kayak as far underneath you as you can with one swift motion, and them immediately push yourself further over the kayak so your head is hanging over the opposite gunwale. Then sit up. Try to be sitting in your kayak within 20 seconds after you get dumped in the water. Try to avoid spending a lot of time in the water swimming from one side of your kayak to the other and assembling self-rescue gear.
To learn this technique, you could try climbing back into one of your buddy's yellow kayaks, which sit lower in the water than your Outback.
I tried using a self-rescue stirrup, and found it no help at all. As soon as I put any weight on the stirrup, my legs would go under the kayak, and because I was trying to climb straight up out of the water, I would tend to pull the kayak over on top of myself. I'm a feeble old fart, but I find the technique described in the first paragraph to be way easier and faster than using a self-rescue stirrup. When I'm spearfishing for pike in Montana, I get back in my kayak many times a day wearing 13-16 pounds of diving weights on my body and about 3.5 pounds on each ankle.
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When getting back into your kayak, fast and simple is better than slow and complicated. The guys in yellow kayaks in your video have the right idea. If your kayak gets flipped over, flip it back upright in the direction it came from (so you won't wrap leashes and fishing line around the hull), grab the gunwale with both hands, kick your feet so you're lying horizontally in the water, pull the kayak as far underneath you as you can with one swift motion, and them immediately push yourself further over the kayak so your head is hanging over the opposite gunwale. Then sit up. Try to be sitting in your kayak within 20 seconds after you get dumped in the water. Try to avoid spending a lot of time in the water swimming from one side of your kayak to the other and assembling self-rescue gear.
To learn this technique, you could try climbing back into one of your buddy's yellow kayaks, which sit lower in the water than your Outback.
I tried using a self-rescue stirrup, and found it no help at all. As soon as I put any weight on the stirrup, my legs would go under the kayak, and because I was trying to climb straight up out of the water, I would tend to pull the kayak over on top of myself. I'm a feeble old fart, but I find the technique described in the first paragraph to be way easier and faster than using a self-rescue stirrup. When I'm spearfishing for pike in Montana, I get back in my kayak many times a day wearing 13-16 pounds of diving weights on my body and about 3.5 pounds on each ankle.
Ok, good advice. I think though, that I'm way ahead of you in the feeble old fart department. Hahaha. I edited outmy first attempt using the quick and simple method for fear of ridicule, I was very surprised how high the outback is when you see it from water level, the main reason I have the stirrups is to turn it back over more quickly. Due to its width and weight I find it a struggle to right it. My first self rescue practice was last year in my first kayak, a pelican boost 100 and was no problem with the quick and easy method. Just tossed it back over, back over the side and into the seat, no problem. The outback is a different story. My conclusion is more practice and maybe outriggers if the feeble old fart syndrome keeps kicking in. Bahaha. My main point is to encourage people to practice self rescue cos you my not be quite so good at it as you think. Like me. Oh and loosing some weight and getting more exercise might help me too. Again, thanks for the good advise.
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Depending on your gear setup, getting back in the middle is not always the easiest/quickest. Coming over the front allows you to use bulkhead cover straps to pull the kayak under you with the length of the kayak serving as a counterweight. Once in it may be hard to get around fish finders etc., but you're working on that problem while out of the water. Stay low and crawl to the middle. Works ok in waves as well by pointing the away end into the wind.
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Yes, thats a good idea, I'm working on a way to clear my foredeck of obstructions either permanent or during re boarding. I've got to work on that. I have a camera, rod holder and fish finder in the way. Even If I clear one side it might be more doable. Got to work on this. My wife will kill me if I drowned in the lake. Thanks.
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Thats why I keep the right side of my outback clear. I also have to use a self rescue assist device for my Outback. In my Ocean Kayak its no problem but the side of the Outback is so high when in the water. When using the stirrup you have to do it at an angle otherwise you'll just pull the kayak over on yourself. It takes practice but once you figure it out you'll be popping right in first time.
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When using the stirrup you have to do it at an angle otherwise you'll just pull the kayak over on yourself. It takes practice but once you figure it out you'll be popping right in first time.
Post a video which shows how to do it! I haven't had any success in my limited experimenting with a stirrup.
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When using the stirrup you have to do it at an angle otherwise you'll just pull the kayak over on yourself. It takes practice but once you figure it out you'll be popping right in first time.
Post a video which shows how to do it! I haven't had any success in my limited experimenting with a stirrup.
Next time I'm out I'll put something together. In the mean time checkout the videos for the waterbug self rescue step. That's where I started at.
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When using the stirrup you have to do it at an angle otherwise you'll just pull the kayak over on yourself. It takes practice but once you figure it out you'll be popping right in first time.
Post a video which shows how to do it! I haven't had any success in my limited experimenting with a stirrup.
Here is an option Im going to try. I already have the paddle float, just need the strapping.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8ya9csKfkk
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Let me qualify myself before making any comments.
I have over 10K posts on NCKA, been an active member since 2005, so please don't let my post count here (or lack of) shadow my comment.
I am extremely passionate about what we called back in the day 'getting back on your kayak'. The term now is 'self rescue'.
And that's what it should be SELF rescue. Unless you've suffered an injury you should be able to get back onto your kayak w/o assistance.
First and foremost...get back on the kayak!
Whatever gear you have is 100% replaceable..you are not.
I've seen more guys become hypothermic because they wasted way too much time in the water.
Gather your stuff once you are comfortably aboard.
Getting back on the kayak is just as easy as getting out of a built-in pool. The principle is the same.
Both hands on the side, kick as you lift yourself aboard. As you do this, pull your hands towards your hips. This will slide the kayak underneath you.
Lay flat on your belly.
Roll onto your back.
Sit up.
Put your feet forward.
If you are new to this, practice with a bare kayak. Once you get it down pat, add whatever gear you would normally take with you.
My preferred method of righting my kayak is to reach under to the other side, pull it down as I push up on the side closest to me. Easy peasy and no struggling involved at all.
I also practice righting the kayak from the bow and stern. You never know where you will end up or how much time you have to get back on and get moving.
I recommend practicing getting on your kayak while it is upside down and walking from bow to stern as well.
I put my kids through the grinder on these drills so when (not if) they unexpectedly go for a swim tacking care of business isn't even a second thought.
Below are a couple of pics practicing what I preach at Lake Tahoe...not exactly warm water. ;)
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@ Brit, I think that's a lot of different parts to try and assemble while bobbing around in the water. That's why I like the stirrup. Its already attached to my boat and either under my seat or in the side pocket. I just right the kayak, pull out the stirrup and I'm aboard. Its not pretty and fluid like some others that are in better shape then my self but I get aboard pretty quick.
@tote, I still practice trying to board my boat without the stirrup and I am getting better at it but I can still do it quicker with the stirrup. Maybe once I lose another 50 lbs and build up some better upper body strength I'll be able to go it with out the stirrup but until then my stirrup will always be attached to the right side grab handle of my Outback but I'm not giving up on trying to master it. I can do it easily on my other kayak but it sits lower in the water than the Outback. BTW, that's some crazy balance skills but I don't understand what walking around on the underside of kayak helps with besides showing what balance skills you have.
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When using the stirrup you have to do it at an angle otherwise you'll just pull the kayak over on yourself. It takes practice but once you figure it out you'll be popping right in first time.
Post a video which shows how to do it! I haven't had any success in my limited experimenting with a stirrup.
Here is an option Im going to try. I already have the paddle float, just need the strapping.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8ya9csKfkk
This looks like it would work for you Tony. The strap hanging off the paddle allows you to get your feet under you and the paddle float gives the boat stability. Let's try it!
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@ Brit, I think that's a lot of different parts to try and assemble while bobbing around in the water. That's why I like the stirrup. Its already attached to my boat and either under my seat or in the side pocket. I just right the kayak, pull out the stirrup and I'm aboard. Its not pretty and fluid like some others that are in better shape then my self but I get aboard pretty quick.
@tote, I still practice trying to board my boat without the stirrup and I am getting better at it but I can still do it quicker with the stirrup. Maybe once I lose another 50 lbs and build up some better upper body strength I'll be able to go it with out the stirrup but until then my stirrup will always be attached to the right side grab handle of my Outback but I'm not giving up on trying to master it. I can do it easily on my other kayak but it sits lower in the water than the Outback. BTW, that's some crazy balance skills but I don't understand what walking around on the underside of kayak helps with besides showing what balance skills you have.
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Because I want to be Helen Freaking Keller when I go in the drink. The more $#!t you put yourself through the less $#!T you'll be dealing with when the real $#!T hits the fan.
What if, for whatever reason, your kayak got a hole in the bottom?
Maybe I might have to flip it over to keep it from sinking. Then maybe I might have to stand up on it to flag someone down.
I taught martial arts for 25 years.
We used to train in all kinds of crazy stuff.
Do I ever think I'll get in a fight in a spring creek under a waterfall in freezing water...hell no. Did I train for it...yep.
And why not? If you are going to practice something, max it out. It's only going to make you better.
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@ Brit, I think that's a lot of different parts to try and assemble while bobbing around in the water. That's why I like the stirrup. Its already attached to my boat and either under my seat or in the side pocket. I just right the kayak, pull out the stirrup and I'm aboard. Its not pretty and fluid like some others that are in better shape then my self but I get aboard pretty quick.
@tote, I still practice trying to board my boat without the stirrup and I am getting better at it but I can still do it quicker with the stirrup. Maybe once I lose another 50 lbs and build up some better upper body strength I'll be able to go it with out the stirrup but until then my stirrup will always be attached to the right side grab handle of my Outback but I'm not giving up on trying to master it. I can do it easily on my other kayak but it sits lower in the water than the Outback. BTW, that's some crazy balance skills but I don't understand what walking around on the underside of kayak helps with besides showing what balance skills you have.
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Because I want to be Helen Freaking Keller when I go in the drink. The more $#!t you put yourself through the less $#!T you'll be dealing with when the real $#!T hits the fan.
What if, for whatever reason, your kayak got a hole in the bottom?
Maybe I might have to flip it over to keep it from sinking. Then maybe I might have to stand up on it to flag someone down.
I taught martial arts for 25 years.
We used to train in all kinds of crazy stuff.
Do I ever think I'll get in a fight in a spring creek under a waterfall in freezing water...hell no. Did I train for it...yep.
And why not? If you are going to practice something, max it out. It's only going to make you better.
Tote, thanks for your input. While I don’t disagree with anything you said, at my age I’m never going to be able to master the keel walking example. Especially when sometimes I have trouble getting up off the sofa. Having said that, this is a work in progress for me. The main reason I even posted this, putting myself out there for ridicule. Was to stimulate discussion about a skill that I strongly feel is vitally important. Also to prevent complacency about ones ability to get back on your kayak. What works for some may not work for others, for their own personal reasons. So I’m keeping on working out what works for me, in a controlled and assisted environment. My other options are to get outriggers or quit kayaking.
Thanks again for your input and passion.
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I have a fish pond on my place that gets nice and warm in the summer and is 25 feet deep and is great for doing rescue practice. A few years ago I picked up a new OK Big Game 2, a big heavy, wide fishing machine.
I'm near 76 so not a kid anymore with young buck arms. I found it was tough getting back in so went for a inflatable NRS paddle float (inflatable) and made a couple paddle loops of para cord behind the seat.
Works excellent as I can right the boat (easy) slide the paddle through the loops, put on the float and crawl up the paddle into the boat. Did it 15 times last year until I was pretty pooped.
Then last fall the sh## hit the fan...found out I had lemphoma cancer in neck. After 7 months of kemo (not a fun thing) was cured BUT the kemo will suck the strength out of you real bad, so bad I couldn't get back in the boat so yak fishing has pretty much been on hold this summer as I fish mostly alone.
BUT... I solved the loss of arm strength too. I carry a pair of scuba flippers in the front hatch or on the deck they fit over my booties well, takes just a coupler seconds to put them on and I can get in the yak fast like a seal jumping up on a dock. Don't need the paddle float with the flippers.
Yea, it's a couple aids that take a little time to get on or set up but at age 75 sure beats setting on the beach watching others yak fishing. So go with the aids if they help get you on the water.....warf
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I have a fish pond on my place that gets nice and warm in the summer and is 25 feet deep and is great for doing rescue practice. A few years ago I picked up a new OK Big Game 2, a big heavy, wide fishing machine.
I'm near 76 so not a kid anymore with young buck arms. I found it was tough getting back in so went for a inflatable NRS paddle float (inflatable) and made a couple paddle loops of para cord behind the seat.
Works excellent as I can right the boat (easy) slide the paddle through the loops, put on the float and crawl up the paddle into the boat. Did it 15 times last year until I was pretty pooped.
Then last fall the sh## hit the fan...found out I had lemphoma cancer in neck. After 7 months of kemo (not a fun thing) was cured BUT the kemo will suck the strength out of you real bad, so bad I couldn't get back in the boat so yak fishing has pretty much been on hold this summer as I fish mostly alone.
BUT... I solved the loss of arm strength too. I carry a pair of scuba flippers in the front hatch or on the deck they fit over my booties well, takes just a coupler seconds to put them on and I can get in the yak fast like a seal jumping up on a dock. Don't need the paddle float with the flippers.
Yea, it's a couple aids that take a little time to get on or set up but at age 75 sure beats setting on the beach watching others yak fishing. So go with the aids if they help get you on the water.....warf
Warf, thank you for your post. I particularly like the swim fins idea. I'm sorry to hear about your cancer, I hope the chemo is or has worked for you. It seems we are in similar situations. Until last year I was suffering from undiagnosed major sleep apnea, I had so many related joint and mobility problems that my wife had to help me put my socks on. Since my diagnosis I have improved my mobility 95%. Lost 40lbs and started kayak fishing. My firs kayak was a Pelican Boost 100. My wife and I did self rescue drills before we did much else, neither of us had any problem righting and re-entering our kayaks. Very soon I realized I needed a wider more stable kayak for my weight and age, 235# and 69yo. So I got a Hobie Outback. Come to find its a whole lot harder to right and re-enter. Hence my post. To stimulate discussion and self analysis. I appreciate your input. I speaks to me on my level. I'm in CdA. If you ever need company out fishing, feel free to message or e-mail me. Im retired and mainly fish during the week. I like fishing for all local species.
Idaho Brit
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Thats why I keep the right side of my outback clear. I also have to use a self rescue assist device for my Outback. In my Ocean Kayak its no problem but the side of the Outback is so high when in the water. When using the stirrup you have to do it at an angle otherwise you'll just pull the kayak over on yourself. It takes practice but once you figure it out you'll be popping right in first time.
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Thanks Mr Monkey, I hear you about the high freeboard on the Outback. I'll bear your comments in mind.
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Hey Brit,
I finally watched the video, for some reason I couldn't watch it on the puter and had to watch it on my phone via tapatalk. Let me know when you are going back out to practice some more. I'm considering getting an outback and need to know if I can get back in it.
Aloha,
Scott
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Hey Brit,
I finally watched the video, for some reason I couldn't watch it on the puter and had to watch it on my phone via tapatalk. Let me know when you are going back out to practice some more. I'm considering getting an outback and need to know if I can get back in it.
Aloha,
Scott
Hi Scott,
Yes lets go out again, you are welcome to try my kayak, I'll try to see when Todd can come out with us. How did you like Todd's Revo? Tri State outfitters in Coeur d' Alene has discounted their Hobies by $500.00 right now. You might want to consider waiting till the new Hobies with reverse drive come out next year. Just a thought. I'll let you know when we can do this.
Tony,
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Sounds good
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