NorthWest Kayak Anglers

Kayak Fishing => Product Discussions => Topic started by: Larry_MayII_HR on April 19, 2022, 07:45:38 PM

Title: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Larry_MayII_HR on April 19, 2022, 07:45:38 PM
Hi all,

I'm looking for some suggestions for a general purpose rod that could serve double/triple duty for trout (trolling), Kokanee (trolling and vertical jigging), and maybe crappie/perch/walleye vertical presentations (secondary importance). I'm looking for a mid range rod, maybe $70 to $100 MSRP, to be paired most days with a Daiwa Lexa 100 LC. I'm targeting something around 7 ft in length, maybe 7'6". I could swing ML fast action or a M moderate or moderate fast.  Seems like for a multi purpose rod, medium power might be more applicable, but open to suggestions.

Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

Steve / LM_II
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: jed on April 19, 2022, 08:47:31 PM
I really liked my Lamiglas X-11 Ultra light 7'rod. It says UL but it was a little heavier and could take on some bigger fish.I used it for my all around rod for Bass/crappie/trout. Pulled in some big carp too. Sensitive enough to catch panfish and trout but fair power. Retails for $75 but you may be able to find it on sale.

Before that I used a Okuma Celilo that also did well.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Shin09 on April 20, 2022, 10:08:23 AM
I think most koke trolling rods are going to be a slower action which would make them less preferable for jigging.  They are almost all UL weight rods too (but I have landed a 20 inch rainbow on one of mine without a problem).  If jigging is a secondary method for you and you understand the limitations then most of the koke specific trolling rods would work.    I have used the red Lami, the yellow eagle claw, and the Berkley Lightning Rod UL (its an 8 foot rod though).  To date I think I like the Berkley the most.  The Lami and the Eagle Claw are pretty indistinguishable to me except that the Lami is built better.    I have also pinch hit with a Medium uglystik GX2 when i needed an extra rod out before I had more kokee specific rods and it was certainly inferior for the purpose of catching and keeping kokanee on the line.   

Of the Koke specific rods, the Okuma SST ones seem to be the fastest action and they come in an UL and L weight.  I haven't ever used one, just handled in the store, but the tip seemed really fragile to me.   
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Clayman on April 20, 2022, 12:04:25 PM
I don't fish kokanee as often as I used to, but when I did, I exclusively jigged for them. The Fenwick HMG 6'6" light, moderate-fast rated for 4-8lb line (HMG66L-MFS-2) paired with 10 lb braid, a 6 lb fluoro topshot, and a 3/4 oz P-Line Laser Minnow, slayed many kokes. It also slayed many trout and even a few incidental mackinaw in the 12-15 lb range. Great rod for jigging, high sensitivity yet with just enough backbone to keep a big mackinaw from owning you.

It's a spinning rod, so it won't really meld with your Lexa. But throw your favorite 2000 series spinning reel on it and you'll be set for vertical jigging.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: LawyerBob on April 20, 2022, 01:09:57 PM
As others have noted, kokanee trolling rods tend to be ultra lights/lights with slow to moderate-slow tip action (seems limp near the tip when you shake it back and forth).

I've tried trolling with a fast action, moderate power jigging rod for kokes but they came off the hook a lot. It seemed to shoot the hook out of their mouth rather than load up pressure on them. But those same rods are/were great for jigging. Another guy I was with was trolling on a light rod, and he had a much higher hookup rate with the same bait.

I'm now running separate jigging rods (light to medium power; moderate to fast action) and trolling rods (light power; slow to moderate-slow action).

Here's some useful videos:

https://youtu.be/ZA_BoexsbQY (https://youtu.be/ZA_BoexsbQY)

https://youtu.be/uFvuAZpGvNo (https://youtu.be/uFvuAZpGvNo)

Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Captain Redbeard on April 21, 2022, 01:56:35 PM
I'm not an expert on kokanee but that's never stopped me from weighing in before...  ;D

I know some guys really like this rod for kokanee trolling, and I'm sure it would work for trout:
https://www.eagleclaw.com/eagle%20claw%20featherlight%20kokanee%20special

Also, Fisherman's has an Okuma kokanee combo right now that seems like a good value: long, limber rod with a small Convector line counter reel. I recently started using the same reel on one of my walleye rods and I've been surprised how much I like it for a relatively inexpensive line counter.
https://fishermans-marine.com/okuma-convector-kokanee-combo-cv-c-762l-163d.html

I would tend to agree with the above comments that, in general, you might be happier with different action rods for trolling vs. jigging.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Shin09 on April 21, 2022, 02:03:13 PM
The yellow eagle claw rods have quite abit of backbone.  I recall reading on ifish guys were using them for real sockeye up on Baker. 

90% sure that okuma combo is using the SST rod just with different graphics/labeling.  Regardless, its a steal because that reel on its own typically costs 80 at the sale price and more at MSRP.  I have one and have been happy with it so far.  I prefer it to the lexa 100, but they are pretty close. 
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Tinker on April 21, 2022, 08:01:34 PM
I think Okuma released a run of their classic copper-ish SST Kokanee rods in grey before they (seem to have) replaced them with the Black version.  I have one of the older SST's and a newer grey SST, both are spinning rods, and other than color, I can't tell the difference between the two.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Larry_MayII_HR on April 26, 2022, 05:25:39 PM
Hi all, thanks for all of the input. Also for the reality check that a trolling rod that's also a jigging rod likely isn't going to do either particularly well. I'm interested in the Okuma rods for trout/koke trolling (sst or black) mostly because I've had good luck with their gear in the past, and they also have better hardware and warranty for the price (generally, imo). I'll let you know how this all turns out.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Tinker on April 27, 2022, 07:21:19 AM
Now I have a question: jigging for kokanee isn't at all like jigging for larger and(or) less tender-lipped fish.  Why wouldn't a trolling rod work for both techniques? 
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Clayman on April 27, 2022, 09:15:21 AM
I find it easier to feel bites and set the hook with a fast-action rod with high sensitivity vs a slow-action/trolling rod. Unlike trolling, the kokes rarely hook themselves on a vertical jig. You usually gotta swing on them to stick em, and the bites are fast (hence the need for a rod where you can feel the bites). A shorter rod (under 7 ft) also feels easier to jig for long periods of time, less fatigue and there's no need for the extra length.

A rod with some backbone also tilts the odds in your favor when you hook into larger non-target species like mackinaw and trout.

Most of the kokanee I lose on jigs come off when they're thrashing around on the surface and they throw the jig. Maybe a long, slow-action trolling rod would keep a few more of them on vs a short, fast-action by picking up more slack line. But I also believe I would miss more bites jigging with a slow-action rod with less sensitivity.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: snopro on April 27, 2022, 09:18:59 AM
Now I have a question: jigging for kokanee isn't at all like jigging for larger and(or) less tender-lipped fish.  Why wouldn't a trolling rod work for both techniques? 
The same principles apply, but scaled down to the species.  Koke trolling rods are generally light with medium action.  Koke jigging rods are light with fast or ex fast action.  If you tried jigging with a trolling rod, the rod would absorb much of the movement and impart less action to the jig.  Jigging rods also tend to be more sensitive than trolling rods so you can feel for the all important line "tic".
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Tinker on April 27, 2022, 01:08:37 PM
The same principles apply, but scaled down to the species.  Koke trolling rods are generally light with medium action.  Koke jigging rods are light with fast or ex fast action.  If you tried jigging with a trolling rod, the rod would absorb much of the movement and impart less action to the jig.  Jigging rods also tend to be more sensitive than trolling rods so you can feel for the all important line "tic".

And this explains why I've never jigged for fish.  Thank you.  I appreciate it.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Shin09 on April 27, 2022, 01:34:37 PM
I havent really seriously jigged for Kokes so others that have done so more probably have better input.  That being said, the one time I did kind of jig for them, I just used one of my trolling rods and actually drift/jigged an arrowflash dodger with a hoochie on the end + a cannon ball to get it down.  Actually worked pretty well in the grand scheme of things, landed 3 or 4 fish.  I found that time they bit pretty aggressively, but maybe that was the ones I actually hooked into vs. maybe I missed a bunch of bites? 

If you are trying to reduce # of rods and increase rod use overlap, a light bass rod could probably sub in for the koke jigging stick. 
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Clayman on April 27, 2022, 02:48:16 PM
I havent really seriously jigged for Kokes so others that have done so more probably have better input.  That being said, the one time I did kind of jig for them, I just used one of my trolling rods and actually drift/jigged an arrowflash dodger with a hoochie on the end + a cannon ball to get it down.  Actually worked pretty well in the grand scheme of things, landed 3 or 4 fish.  I found that time they bit pretty aggressively, but maybe that was the ones I actually hooked into vs. maybe I missed a bunch of bites? 
 
Ha, nice. Sometimes the bigger kokes (over 12") can whack a jig pretty good. But often times, they like to peck at it when the jig is on the drop.

I like jigging kokes because it's simple and fun. I just cruise along until I mark a school of kokes, drop the jig on em, and fish em until I limit out or I've had my fill. The fish have a good opportunity to show off their fighting skills when they're not dragging a flasher/dodger behind them. And it's a great way to introduce kids or newbies to kokanee fishing. I've had no issues fishing a 3/4 oz jig over 100 feet down to catch kokanee.
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Mellow Yellow on April 30, 2022, 09:54:42 PM
For 10 years, the only pole I ever wanted to use for kokes is my Lamiglas Team Kokanee Jared Johnson. I love that rod.

And then I was pointed to a Velocity Ninja Kokanee Series. What a versatile rod! Trolling, jigging-- kokes, trout, perch, pinks, sockeye-- it does it all. Nice tip with *big* backbone. I run Daiwa Lexa LC 100's on both. Best price on these is often at Sportsmans.

https://fishvelocity.com/ninja-kokanee-black-rod/ (https://fishvelocity.com/ninja-kokanee-black-rod/)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mnljYp9i4g (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mnljYp9i4g)
Title: Re: General purpose trout/kokanee rod suggestion?
Post by: Larry_MayII_HR on May 10, 2022, 03:08:01 PM
Kokanee black 7'6" Light action model KB-C-762L just arrived from Fish Field :)))

My first impression is that I am very pleased with the action of the rod. It has a nice moderate action that doesn't feel like a limp noodle. With a decent amount of force applied it will flex back to about the last guide-ish before the foregrip, but it also appears to have a nice backbone to support fishing with a few ounces of cannon balls (I don't have a downrigger) or if you need to lay the wood to a bigger fish.

I'll report on how she does after the first outing.