NorthWest Kayak Anglers
Kayak Fishing => Let's Talk Kayak Fishing => Topic started by: danr on December 10, 2016, 06:19:08 PM
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Hey all, I was just reading up on oregons fishing regs for 2017, as of jan 1st, all boats fishing for ground (bottom) fish, must have a descending device on board, i copied and pasted this from ODF page...
" The Oregon Fish and Wildlife Commission has adopted new regulations that go into effect on January 1, 2017, including a requirement that vessels fishing for groundfish (bottomfish) in the ocean must have a descending device on board and must use a descending device for all rockfish released outside of 30 fathoms. There are also changes to bag limits. News release "
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here's the link to the page: http://www.dfw.state.or.us/news/2016/12_dec/120216b.asp
I have used a "descender" before. I think its a good thing. Always hated to see "floaters" for species that I couldn't retain. there are some simple, non-commercial methods that can be employed from a kayak. Personally don't see much of an impact for kayak fisher's.
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The seven fish marine bag limit will remain in place, with these adjustments for 2017:
Create a sub-bag limit of six black rockfish.
Remove the sub-bag limit for canary rockfish.
Add China/quillback/copper rockfishes to the sub-bag limit with blue/Deacon rockfish and change the limit from three to four fish.
Remove the 10-inch minimum size for kelp greenling.
So, I read this as follows:
Still have the 7 fish marine bag limit as we did before.
Of that we can only keep 6 black rockfish.
Can we keep a canary rockfish, if so how many?
We can keep up to 4 in aggregate =China/quill/copper/blue-Deacon rockfish.
No size minimum on kelp greenling.
What about the Cabezon?
Is this what you read, or other? It's kind of written in cryptic lawyer language. :dontknow:
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the way I read it, if canary rockfish no longer have their own "sublimit" and are not part of any other sublimit then they fall into the "total" category which would be retention of seven.
For cabezon, the 2017 regulations still state a one fish limit with a minimum length of 16 inches.
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The seven fish marine bag limit will remain in place, with these adjustments for 2017:
Create a sub-bag limit of six black rockfish.
Remove the sub-bag limit for canary rockfish.
Add China/quillback/copper rockfishes to the sub-bag limit with blue/Deacon rockfish and change the limit from three to four fish.
Remove the 10-inch minimum size for kelp greenling.
So, I read this as follows:
Still have the 7 fish marine bag limit as we did before.
Of that we can only keep 6 black rockfish.
Can we keep a canary rockfish, if so how many?
We can keep up to 4 in aggregate =China/quill/copper/blue-Deacon rockfish.
No size minimum on kelp greenling.
What about the Cabezon?
Is this what you read, or other? It's kind of written in cryptic lawyer language. :dontknow:
that is pretty much how I read it, the 2017 perm. regs still need to be updated, that should clear things up more. here is a link to the initial 2017 regs:
http://www.eregulations.com/oregon/17orfw/
my read is no change to Cabezon season or size/limit; canary move to 'any or all of the 7 fish limit', and anyone bottom fishing is required to carry a descending device. I watched the ODFW videos and decided on the Shelton products version ($6 + $3 shipping, arrived in 2 days) since I can easily use it at any depth. I'm going to rig it up on my green "Mutant Ninja Turtles" rod.
These changes lead me to believe the populations of China/quillback/copper/canary have recovered nicely, which is great news.
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These are the highlights:
Changes:
• sublimit of 6 blacks
• sublimit of 4 china/blue/deacon/quillback/copper in total
• no minimum size on greenling
• no sublimit on canary
• descending device must be onboard. Required to use at > 30 fm
Reminders:
• limit is still 7 RCG and 2 lingcod
• cabezon retention July 1-Dec 31 sublimit 1
You guys have it right. The minor nearshore complex species of concern have shown sufficient improvement to allow them to be part of a 4 fish sublimit. You can retain up to 7 canary as part of your 7 fish RCG limit. You have to carry a descender. You have to acutually use it > 30 fm. You guys got all that stuff right.
I wish ODFW required halibut fishermen to have descenders on board. Other than that, this is a real win for Oregon rec anglers. If you guys think this is bad or confusing, you should try fishing in California or Washington sometime. ODFW seems to actually care about both the fish AND the fishermen. So we get to keep the year round season. That's what this is all about - getting to keep the year round recreational groundfish fishery.
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Hey all, I was just reading up on oregons fishing regs for 2017, as of jan 1st, all boats fishing for ground (bottom) fish, must have a descending device on board, i copied and pasted this from ODF page...
" The Oregon Fish and Wildlife Commission has adopted new regulations that go into effect on January 1, 2017, including a requirement that vessels fishing for groundfish (bottomfish) in the ocean must have a descending device on board and must use a descending device for all rockfish released outside of 30 fathoms. There are also changes to bag limits. News release "
worth noting that "groundfish" species in the regs include all the varieties of rockfish, plus: lingcod, greenling, and cabezon.
so although the requirement is to use the descender only for rockfish outside 30 fathoms, the requirement to carry it is for any boat in the ocean that is bottomfishing for any groundfish.
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Hey all, I was just reading up on oregons fishing regs for 2017, as of jan 1st, all boats fishing for ground (bottom) fish, must have a descending device on board, i copied and pasted this from ODF page...
" The Oregon Fish and Wildlife Commission has adopted new regulations that go into effect on January 1, 2017, including a requirement that vessels fishing for groundfish (bottomfish) in the ocean must have a descending device on board and must use a descending device for all rockfish released outside of 30 fathoms. There are also changes to bag limits. News release "
worth noting that "groundfish" species in the regs include all the varieties of rockfish, plus: lingcod, greenling, and cabezon.
so although the requirement is to use the descender only for rockfish outside 30 fathoms, the requirement to carry it is for any boat in the ocean that is bottomfishing for any groundfish.
No need to use a descender on cabezones, greenlings or lingcod though, since they lack swim bladders and do not suffer from barotrauma.
The descender rule is all about protecting yelloweye. I've been using simple sheldon descenders for years, give them away when I have extra, and encourage everyone to use them when releasing rockfish anything greater than about 50 feet.
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The descender rule is all about protecting yelloweye. I've been using simple sheldon descenders for years, give them away when I have extra, and encourage everyone to use them when releasing rockfish anything greater than about 50 feet.
I have a Sheldon descender in a box in one of the closets but never used it. Haven't even looked at it in long time. Does it require a second rod/reel like shown in You Tube videos?
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The descender rule is all about protecting yelloweye. I've been using simple sheldon descenders for years, give them away when I have extra, and encourage everyone to use them when releasing rockfish anything greater than about 50 feet.
I have a Sheldon descender in a box in one of the closets but never used it. Haven't even looked at it in long time. Does it require a second rod/reel like shown in You Tube videos?
NOt required. I usually swap out the descender for my iron/leadhead/weight where it is hooked to a ball bearing snap swivel. It takes seconds. I have the pin ziptied to a length of bungie and a one pound ball on the bottom. It's the most efficient release with the pin that I've tried but I'm always open to see how others are doing it.
You can put them inline on your jigging line but that is just two more knots that can fail. I've never really liked that idea.
SOme people use an old rod/reel or even a barbie pole with the line swapped out.
You are shooting for 2/3 of the depth where you caught the fish, so if you catch in 120' releasing at least 80' deep. Remember that when releasing or if you are using a barbie pole or something.
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Thanks! I have a short Barbie-sized pole but that's just one more rod in the Revo. I like your method.
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I like the new regs, but can't remember the last time I fished in +30 fm, so I never catch yelloweye. I have bt'd blacks & blues at +10 fm. I should carry less stuff for surf launch & exit but guess I'll add a desender. Would it work inline?
(http://www.sheltonproducts.com/SFDanglersetup.jpg)
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I like the new regs, but can't remember the last time I fished in +30 fm, so I never catch yelloweye. I have bt'd blacks & blues at +10 fm. I should carry less stuff for surf launch & exit but guess I'll add a desender. Would it work inline?
(http://www.sheltonproducts.com/SFDanglersetup.jpg)
Yelloweye can be caught shallower than that. They tend to congregate which is why there are YE conservation areas like stonewall bank, which is fairly shallow in spots. I caught 2 last year in 110 ft of water in California near shelter cove.
Inline descenders never really worked well for me. I need more weight to descend a fish than the 4oz in your picture - I like a 16oz ball - especially if you are descending a 7 lbs+ YE. That and I've got rockfish unbuttoned from the pin only to immediately foul hook them on the lead head hook, have to bring them back up and do it over again.
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I like the new regs, but can't remember the last time I fished in +30 fm, so I never catch yelloweye. I have bt'd blacks & blues at +10 fm. I should carry less stuff for surf launch & exit but guess I'll add a desender. Would it work inline?
(http://www.sheltonproducts.com/SFDanglersetup.jpg)
Yelloweye can be caught shallower than that. They tend to congregate which is why there are YE conservation areas like stonewall bank, which is fairly shallow in spots. I caught 2 last year in 110 ft of water in California near shelter cove.
Inline descenders never really worked well for me. I need more weight to descend a fish than the 4oz in your picture - I like a 16oz ball - especially if you are descending a 7 lbs+ YE. That and I've got rockfish unbuttoned from the pin only to immediately foul hook them on the lead head hook, have to bring them back up and do it over again.
Good advice, thanks.
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Inline descenders never really worked well for me. I need more weight to descend a fish than the 4oz in your picture - I like a 16oz ball - especially if you are descending a 7 lbs+ YE. That and I've got rockfish unbuttoned from the pin only to immediately foul hook them on the lead head hook, have to bring them back up and do it over again.
Crash, I haven't assembled a descender setup yet. How do you think this setup would work: From bottom to top, a 1 pound weight, a foot of mono, the descender, four feet of mono, and a snap clip. Put it in a water bottle holder or tray in your kayak, and hook the snap clip to something so the mono won't get tangled. If you catch a fish which you want to release, clip the descender to your lowest leadhead jig, hook the fish to the descender, and lower the fish. When you get the fish to the depth at which you want to release it, your leadhead jig would be four feet above the fish, and when you jerk your line to release the fish, the jig will be heading up away from the fish. How do you think that would work? It seems to me that advantages of this setup would be (a) you wouldn't need to remove your lures from your line before attaching the descender setup, and (b) you wouldn't need a second pole for the descender.
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Inline descenders never really worked well for me. I need more weight to descend a fish than the 4oz in your picture - I like a 16oz ball - especially if you are descending a 7 lbs+ YE. That and I've got rockfish unbuttoned from the pin only to immediately foul hook them on the lead head hook, have to bring them back up and do it over again.
Crash, I haven't assembled a descender setup yet. How do you think this setup would work: From bottom to top, a 1 pound weight, a foot of mono, the descender, four feet of mono, and a snap clip. Put it in a water bottle holder or tray in your kayak, and hook the snap clip to something so the mono won't get tangled. If you catch a fish which you want to release, clip the descender to your lowest leadhead jig, hook the fish to the descender, and lower the fish. When you get the fish to the depth at which you want to release it, your leadhead jig would be four feet above the fish, and when you jerk your line to release the fish, the jig will be heading up away from the fish. How do you think that would work? It seems to me that advantages of this setup would be (a) you wouldn't need to remove your lures from your line before attaching the descender setup, and (b) you wouldn't need a second pole for the descender.
Should work. Using mono gives a bit of stretch, which is good and which is why I use bungee. You would want to use a low memory mono or change it often. I don't think 4' is necessary, 18" ought to do. I haven't hooked one on any shrimp flies that I have left on, although I have hooked rockfish on the flies while trying to descend a different fish before. Easiest is to have a dedicated descender rod, but if you only take one rod with you then having a setup that you can quickly change out is a close second.
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This was a pretty simple setup for descending floaters
http://www.ifish.net/board/showthread.php?p=13760049#post13760049
very suitable for a kayak.
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This might be a stupid question but how do you get the fish grip to release at depth?
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This might be a stupid question but how do you get the fish grip to release at depth?
Not stupid at all because I have let go of them with a rolling lingcod on and it was still there after I pulled them back up ( had a brass swivel and big bungee cord on) they don't release till you open them.
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When you give the rope a jerk, the orange fish grips pop open - if they don't pop open and stay open, then you put too many wraps on the rubber band for the amount of weight you're using, or you put the weight on the wrong handle of the grips. The orange fish grips have sort of a vice grip type action to them, and you should put the weight on the orange arm that hinges open. Take a look at the grips and you'll see that one side is rigid to the top clamp, the other handle is hinged to the bottom clamp.
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Ok "stupid is as stupid does" after zooming way in I noticed the weight and line is attached to the lock lever side of the grips with almost invisible (in this photo)fishing line so the pliers are inline attached at each handle... free Sheldon is my go to
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Easy compact descender that fits in my tackle box made from a 16 oz sinker, dacron line, a snap, and a barbless hook:
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-Fgm926g/0/L/i-Fgm926g-L.jpg)
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-TjKfHM7/0/L/i-TjKfHM7-L.jpg)
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Pics aren't working, Craig
Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
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Pics aren't working, Craig
Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
I see them.
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I do now as well
Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
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I will tell you how not to descend a fish. Do not use a 9 1/2 foot 1-6 oz salmon rod and an "improvised on the spot" descender with a 24 oz weight you were using for halibut. When you drop it down 100 feet and give it a good jerk the rod snaps. You get funny looks when you try to warranty the rod. But eventually they buy the story about the epic great white/moa moa battle you trolled through while salmon fishing, and they replace the rod while making the statement: "That's the first time we have ever heard anything like that. Hmmmm... pretty creative." Big shout out for Lamiglass!
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These are the highlights:
Changes:
• sublimit of 6 blacks
• sublimit of 4 china/blue/deacon/quillback/copper in total
• no minimum size on greenling
• no sublimit on canary
• descending device must be onboard. Required to use at > 30 fm
Reminders:
• limit is still 7 RCG and 2 lingcod
• cabezon retention July 1-Dec 31 sublimit 1
You guys have it right. The minor nearshore complex species of concern have shown sufficient improvement to allow them to be part of a 4 fish sublimit. You can retain up to 7 canary as part of your 7 fish RCG limit. You have to carry a descender. You have to acutually use it > 30 fm. You guys got all that stuff right.
I wish ODFW required halibut fishermen to have descenders on board. Other than that, this is a real win for Oregon rec anglers. If you guys think this is bad or confusing, you should try fishing in California or Washington sometime. ODFW seems to actually care about both the fish AND the fishermen. So we get to keep the year round season. That's what this is all about - getting to keep the year round recreational groundfish fishery.
I got confused for a moment because this conflicts with page 94 of the regs. The update is online.
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
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These are the highlights:
Changes:
• sublimit of 6 blacks
• sublimit of 4 china/blue/deacon/quillback/copper in total
• no minimum size on greenling
• no sublimit on canary
• descending device must be onboard. Required to use at > 30 fm
Reminders:
• limit is still 7 RCG and 2 lingcod
• cabezon retention July 1-Dec 31 sublimit 1
You guys have it right. The minor nearshore complex species of concern have shown sufficient improvement to allow them to be part of a 4 fish sublimit. You can retain up to 7 canary as part of your 7 fish RCG limit. You have to carry a descender. You have to acutually use it > 30 fm. You guys got all that stuff right.
I wish ODFW required halibut fishermen to have descenders on board. Other than that, this is a real win for Oregon rec anglers. If you guys think this is bad or confusing, you should try fishing in California or Washington sometime. ODFW seems to actually care about both the fish AND the fishermen. So we get to keep the year round season. That's what this is all about - getting to keep the year round recreational groundfish fishery.
I got confused for a moment because this conflicts with page 94 of the regs. The update is online.
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
This came out a couple weeks after I posted that.
http://www.dfw.state.or.us/MRP/regulations/sport_fishing/docs/what_can_i_keep_how_many_2017.pdf
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The refs say a device is required to be used outside 30 fathoms. So, does that mean if you're inside 30 fathoms you done need to use one or have it on board?
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The refs say a device is required to be used outside 30 fathoms. So, does that mean if you're inside 30 fathoms you done need to use one or have it on board?
If you're fishing for Rockfish at all then you need to have one on board, regardless of how far out or deep you are, you're only required to use it though at 30 fathoms or more.
The Commission also set 2017 groundfish regulations. For the recreational angler, the new regulations will require all groundfish anglers to have a descending device on board the vessel, and will require its use for all rockfish released outside of 30 fathoms. Anglers can find more information about descending devices and how to use them here.
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Thanks Matt, I thought that's what I remembered.
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The way I read the text at the top of the "what can I keep" notice is that the descender needs to be onboard regardless of the depth being fished, if you are fishing for bottomfish. It needs to be deployed when releasing at the 30 fathom mark.
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Here's a couple tips and release mechanisms from the Alaska Department of Fish and Game:
http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=fishingSportFishingInfo.rockfishconservation
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The way I read the text at the top of the "what can I keep" notice is that the descender needs to be onboard regardless of the depth being fished, if you are fishing for bottomfish. It needs to be deployed when releasing at the 30 fathom mark.
Correct.