Preferred Downrigger for Kayak Install

I had been thinking of this for quite some time. In the end I decided to spend more money to install an electric DR on my outback (I am lazy and didn't feel like hand lining the ball up from the deep over and over). I went with the Cannon Mag 5 ST because it had a narrower footprint than the Scotty. I fabricated an aluminum mount using the rear gimbal tube and a piece of gear trac (to anchor the front end). A rotating base allows me to keep the 2 foot boom  close to the yak to minimize the lateral torque.  Battery is kept in the H-crate behind my seat. I had a chance to try it out last week and I am thoroughly impressed. Battery lasted all day. 4 lb ball allowed me to get to the depths I wanted and I could pedal it all day at 2-3 mpg SOG. I did replace the steel cable with braid and used a snubber to minimize the strain on the line. I can easily reach the up/down switch, view the counter and lower the line using the clutch on the DR.


Jason

Nice rig Jason. What size and amperage batt are you using? Those DRs have an auto stop on the retrieve. Does it work on the kayak. I installed one of those on my Tandem Island but the auto stop is not working.
Edit: I just got this answer on the Cannon site: This feature comes on all Cannon electric downriggers and requires the boat to be properly grounded. Still asking about the battery though.

Wow! That seems like a nice setup. Will that make it harder to get the kayak back upright if you tip it over?

[/quote]
Nice rig Jason. What size and amperage batt are you using? Those DRs have an auto stop on the retrieve. Does it work on the kayak. I installed one of those on my Tandem Island but the auto stop is not working.
Edit: I just got this answer on the Cannon site: This feature comes on all Cannon electric downriggers and requires the boat to be properly grounded. Still asking about the battery though.
[/quote]

Hey there - I am using the battery that originally came as part of the Hobie Fish Finder kit (I am using a lithium ion battery for why fish finder now). The battery is a 12V 9AHr/20Hr battery. So far no issues.  You are correct, that the auto stop will not work with this set up. It is a bit of a bummer that they don't have a mechanical auto stop. The DR needs to be grounded. Also, it needs the wire cable to be used (I replaced mine with braid). In the end, it is not a huge deal. I simply hold the 'up' button down until I see the counter get to around 15 feet then pay attention to the ball and release the button when the ball hits the surface. I am sure you could make this work with a scotty, but it would take up more real estate and might necessitate moving the DR mount a little more outboard off the edge of the yak with a wider base. I was really looking to keep the DR mounted directly on the rail of the yak.  Holding the button down is still wayyyyy easier than hand cranking 

Wow! That seems like a nice setup. Will that make it harder to get the kayak back upright if you tip it over?

Yeah potentially. I have thought about this quite a bit. In addition to the DR, I modified the outrigger mounting system to be able to use the outrigger pontoons for extra stability (essentially just small spacers and longer bolts to lift up the centre bar and clear the extra height created by the DR base). However, I have not yet used the yak with the DR and pontoons together - that is scheduled for next weekend. I will say, the Outback is very stable even in rough chop and swells. I also keep the arm of the DR pretty close to the yak - minimizes lateral torque and it makes it very easy to reach the cannon ball and clip without leaning out over the edge. I also replaced the cable with braid. I started out with 65 lb power pro, but this was too thin (lost a cannon ball from the jerking motion when the DR was stopped - even with a snubber!). I currently have the DR loaded with Scotty 250 lb braid on it, but I think next season I will drop it down to about '125 lb for the extra safety margin. Also, the Cannon DR has a nice clutch system on it. When I lower the cannon ball using the manual brake, I leave the clutch a bit loose. That way if for some reason the ball hangs up, the DR will let it gradually spool out instead of acting like an anchor and pulling on the edge of the yak. I pay close attention to the depth where I am fishing and don't drop the ball too close to the bottom. Usual other safety issues as well - dry suit, waterproof floating marine VHF radio, life jacket, knife close at hand etc.  I also keep a Hobie rescue step on board to aid with flipping the yak and reentry if needed. Finally, if I do go over and can't actually manage to get it righted, I can always abort the rigger if it really comes to that. Since it is only held in place by the one thumb screw on the gear track, it slips right out of the gimbal mount when the thumb screw is released. Not ideal, but definitely worth aborting the DR if things got real hairy.

Jason

This is the Cannon Mini-Mag 2 electric downrigger I added to my 2013 PA-14 back in 2015.
I removed the downrigger off my 18' Jetcraft I sold in 2009 and then purchased my first Hobie kayak, a 2010 Outback.

I also bought the Canon swivel base, that makes it easy on/off/adjust angle and worth every bit of the $65 it cost.

The battery is mounted behind the front storage bin and is an 18 A/H SLA.....it has plenty of capacity to drop and recover numerous times the 4.25# weight.  I troll in depths of 25' to 120'.
I also changed out the steel cable to 175# Scotty line......much quieter/hardly any noise.

Since my PA-14 does not have the "drop down skeg", I bought the larger rudder to improve tracking.....especially at deeper depths.....the lager rudder does the trick.
     

Wow! That seems like a nice setup. Will that make it harder to get the kayak back upright if you tip it over?

Yeah potentially. I have thought about this quite a bit. In addition to the DR, I modified the outrigger mounting system to be able to use the outrigger pontoons for extra stability (essentially just small spacers and longer bolts to lift up the centre bar and clear the extra height created by the DR base). However, I have not yet used the yak with the DR and pontoons together - that is scheduled for next weekend.

Jason

Absolutely, please do come back on here and let us know  how your 1st experience goes with the DR jointly used with the outrigger pontoons.  I have been considering those pontoons, or even a single.   My concern though is that they kind look like they would turn your useable fishing area around the Yak, into a complete Cluster.  I cannot imagine how one would land a 5-10 lb fish with those pontoons on either side, etc.
I hope it all goes well.

Wow! That seems like a nice setup. Will that make it harder to get the kayak back upright if you tip it over?

Yeah potentially. I have thought about this quite a bit. In addition to the DR, I modified the outrigger mounting system to be able to use the outrigger pontoons for extra stability (essentially just small spacers and longer bolts to lift up the centre bar and clear the extra height created by the DR base). However, I have not yet used the yak with the DR and pontoons together - that is scheduled for next weekend.

Jason

Absolutely, please do come back on here and let us know  how your 1st experience goes with the DR jointly used with the outrigger pontoons.  I have been considering those pontoons, or even a single.   My concern though is that they kind look like they would turn your useable fishing area around the Yak, into a complete Cluster.  I cannot imagine how one would land a 5-10 lb fish with those pontoons on either side, etc.
I hope it all goes well.

This is exactly what I am worried about...

Jason

Here's a cheesy video I made of my "electric downrigger" test from this summer. 

It works GREAT for deploying and raising a downrigger ball for deep trolling kokanee.  I use a 20AH 12v battery as a power source - it weighs about 12lb and goes in the crate behind the seat. 

What video?

You can't see it?  I can.

If you can't see and click on bb2fish's Youtube video when you view her post, click on "quote," copy the link to the video, and paste the link into your browser.

bb2fish, what advantages do you find in using a Tanacom 750 power assist reel as a downrigger, rather than some kind of manual downrigger?  The reel costs about $500; a Cannon Lake-troll downrigger costs between $100 and $150.

bb2fish, what advantages do you find in using a Tanacom 750 power assist reel as a downrigger, rather than some kind of manual downrigger?  The reel costs about $500; a Cannon Lake-troll downrigger costs between $100 and $150.

I borrowed the Tanacom from a friend to do the test (so the cost was minimal to give this a try on my kayak).  I'd suggest seeking out a used power reel if that's the desired course for an electric power assist.  You can't compare a Tanacom to the Canon Lake-troll -- one is power, the other manual, so there will most definitely be a cost differential to get into any power assisted downrigger. 

The purpose I had for doing a power assisted downrigger was for deep trolling -- like 100-200ft deep (at Lake Chelan), and often from 60-100ft deep (at Odell and Green Peter Reservoir) for kokanee and lake trout.  I have since purchased a used Tanacom 750 and will also use it for Halibut fishing 700ft deep (Oregon Offshore).  That's a lot of reeling with 5lb of lead !!  With that amount of lead, I have blowback at those depths, but I'm ok with blowback in lieu of having a much heavier ball.  I still use my "manual downrigger" which is just a conventional line counter reel on the same stiff section of rod shown in the video.  But, I thought I'd post an alternative to the various full scale electric downriggers that a couple of the posts in this thread showed.  I have a Revo11, and the weight and balance of using the Tanacom electric reel in a crate rod holder is far superior over a full size Scotty or Cannon power downrigger rigidly mounted.

bb2fish, what advantages do you find in using a Tanacom 750 power assist reel as a downrigger, rather than some kind of manual downrigger?  The reel costs about $500; a Cannon Lake-troll downrigger costs between $100 and $150.

I borrowed the Tanacom from a friend to do the test (so the cost was minimal to give this a try on my kayak).  I'd suggest seeking out a used power reel if that's the desired course for an electric power assist.  You can't compare a Tanacom to the Canon Lake-troll -- one is power, the other manual, so there will most definitely be a cost differential to get into any power assisted downrigger. 

The purpose I had for doing a power assisted downrigger was for deep trolling -- like 100-200ft deep (at Lake Chelan), and often from 60-100ft deep (at Odell and Green Peter Reservoir) for kokanee and lake trout.  I have since purchased a used Tanacom 750 and will also use it for Halibut fishing 700ft deep (Oregon Offshore).  That's a lot of reeling with 5lb of lead !!  With that amount of lead, I have blowback at those depths, but I'm ok with blowback in lieu of having a much heavier ball.  I still use my "manual downrigger" which is just a conventional line counter reel on the same stiff section of rod shown in the video.  But, I thought I'd post an alternative to the various full scale electric downriggers that a couple of the posts in this thread showed.  I have a Revo11, and the weight and balance of using the Tanacom electric reel in a crate rod holder is far superior over a full size Scotty or Cannon power downrigger rigidly mounted.

Nice idea, and a lot smaller than the Cannon Mag 5 electric downrigger which Ronand1 is using, and the Cannon Mini-Mag 2 electric downrigger which Dr. Steelhead Catcher is using!  Daiwa says the Tanacom 750 has a "momentary winding power of 140 lbs," so the reel shouldn't have any trouble cranking up an eight pound weight.  Next, you could buy a second Tanacom 750 for your rod, and figure out how to slave the reels together so they would raise and lower your downrigger weight and your fishing line simultaneously!

The purpose I had for doing a power assisted downrigger was for deep trolling -- like 100-200ft deep (at Lake Chelan), and often from 60-100ft deep (at Odell and Green Peter Reservoir) for kokanee and lake trout.  I have since purchased a used Tanacom 750 and will also use it for Halibut fishing 700ft deep (Oregon Offshore).  That's a lot of reeling with 5lb of lead !!  With that amount of lead, I have blowback at those depths, but I'm ok with blowback in lieu of having a much heavier ball.  I still use my "manual downrigger" which is just a conventional line counter reel on the same stiff section of rod shown in the video.  But, I thought I'd post an alternative to the various full scale electric downriggers that a couple of the posts in this thread showed.  I have a Revo11, and the weight and balance of using the Tanacom electric reel in a crate rod holder is far superior over a full size Scotty or Cannon power downrigger rigidly mounted.

Great idea Barb.  I agree with everything you said.

Here is my take on the concept.  Keep in mind I fish >100ft deep 95% of the time.  A four pound ball on 80lb spectra hits the sweet spot for me in terms of blowback. 



I tried to minimize the package as far as I could and still fish effectively.  I wanted it to be ultra portable, lightweight, and quick to mount/unmount.

All together my downrigger is 20" long and weighs 2lb.  Total cost was under $175, line included.   For my style of kayak fishing I think it compares favorably to the electric models by scotty and cannon.  At the push of a button this rig will zip 4lbs up 100ft in under 30 seconds and auto stop at the surface with the line clip in reach.  I can get a full day of fishing out of a 5ah 3lb SLA.

Pete was asking about advantages over a manual.  In 2014 I was using a manual downrigger made out of the bottom section of an old salmon rod and a cheap okuma line counter reel.  I lost a few chinook and a nice bull trout because I couldn't retrieve the ball fast enough while playing the fish and they tangled around the downrigger line.  The fishing was great that year and between drive bys and hook ups I was wasting a lot of time pulling the ball back to the surface to reset.  I hit ebay and found the smallest electric I could and scored a gem.  Mounted it up in the configuration you see above and there was no turning back.  The portability and versatility are excellent.  I love my mini rigger!