NorthWest Kayak Anglers
Kayak Fishing => Product Discussions => Topic started by: pmmpete on September 23, 2021, 02:58:56 PM
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Why are kayak manufacturers making so many of their pedal fishing kayaks so heavy? The weight makes it harder to get them on top of your vehicle, and harder to move them from your vehicle to the water. Here are the weights of the hulls, not including seats, drives, and where applicable the big battery for the trolling motor, of some Hobie and Old Town pedal kayaks:
Hobie Lynx - 45 pounds
Hobie Revolution 13 – 70.5 pounds
Hobie Outback – 85 pounds
Sportsman Salty PDL 120 – 89 pounds
Sportsman Bigwater PDL 132 – 95 pounds
Sportsman PDL 120 – 101 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 12 – 105 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 12 360 – 109.5 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 14 – 120.5 pounds
Old Town Sportsman Autopilot 120 – 122 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 14 360 – 124.5 pounds
Old Town Sportsman Autopilot 136 – 128 pounds
I wish there were more light pedal kayaks. In particular, I wish there was a lighter Hobie kayak with a 360 drive, or a lighter Old Town kayak with a spot lock trolling motor. The hull of an Old Town Sportsman Autopilot 136 is 57.5 pounds heavier than the hull of my 13' Revolution! I keep hearing that the Outback can't handle the sideways torque of a 360 drive, but the Outback is only two inches narrower than a Pro Angler. Another product I wish was available is a trolling motor with GPS spot lock capability which I could drop into the drive hole of a Hobie kayak. Yoo Hoo, kayak manufacturers, are you listening?
I suspect that Hobie will sell a lot of Lynx kayaks because they're so light. However, the Lynx doesn't look suitable for ocean and big lake fishing. It looks like waves would constantly be breaking over the kayak.
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Oh sure Pete, leave out the Native propel models! Sheesh!!
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Oh sure Pete, leave out the Native propel models! Sheesh!!
I've added several Native Propel models to my list of fishing kayak hull weights:
Hobie Lynx – 45 pounds
Hobie Revolution 13 – 70.5 pounds
Hobie Outback – 85 pounds
Sportsman Salty PDL 120 – 89 pounds
Sportsman Bigwater PDL 132 – 95 pounds
Native Slayer Propel Max 12.5 – 95 pounds
Sportsman PDL 120 – 101 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 12 – 105 pounds
Native Titan Propel 12 - 109 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 12 360 – 109.5 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 14 – 120.5 pounds
Old Town Sportsman Autopilot 120 – 122 pounds
Hobie Pro Angler 14 360 – 124.5 pounds
Old Town Sportsman Autopilot 136 – 128 pounds
Native Titan Propel 13.5 – 154 pounds
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Why are kayak manufacturers making so many of their pedal fishing kayaks so heavy?
I suspect it's a combination of current manufacturing methods (rotomolding) lending themselves to weightier boats and the fact that the US market is probably hungrier for jon boat type builds (I think only the Revo 13 in your list is below 30" width?), which also lends to heavy boats. I guess that second fact probably stems from the fact that most of the US market is landlocked and restricted to small water?
I'd do terrible things for a light, skinny, and long pedal kayak. There seem to be some neat things coming out of SA (Stealth, Vagabond). If there's ever even just a light pedal kayak introduced to the market, I wouldn't be surprised if it came out of SA.
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:D ^^^^^
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Why are kayak manufacturers making so many of their pedal fishing kayaks so heavy?
I suspect it's a combination of current manufacturing methods (rotomolding) lending themselves to weightier boats and the fact that the US market is probably hungrier for jon boat type builds (I think only the Revo 13 in your list is below 30" width?), which also lends to heavy boats. I guess that second fact probably stems from the fact that most of the US market is landlocked and restricted to small water?
I'd do terrible things for a light, skinny, and long pedal kayak. There seem to be some neat things coming out of SA (Stealth, Vagabond). If there's ever even just a light pedal kayak introduced to the market, I wouldn't be surprised if it came out of SA.
To answer the original question, I agree with what BogueYaker said. That and most people in this country like to bring a tackle shop with them when they fish and then require all kinds of mounting positions for all that gear which adds weight. Then there are the mounting points required for all the cameras. ;D
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Almost that entire list of "kayaks" given right there tend to lean more towards the definition of a "small boat".
Get past that aspect and you'll see the problem.
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Us guys with heavy boats ask for lighter boats to save our backs.
The guys with the light boats will eventually be asking for a boat that is wide and stable, dryer ride, track straight with more weight capacity so they can bring more tackle or even bring a big dog with them.
its always a win some lose some situation.
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The guys with the light boats will eventually be asking for a boat that is wide and stable, dryer ride, track straight with more weight capacity so they can bring more tackle or even bring a big dog with them.
The guys with the light, narrow, and faster kayaks will not be switching to a heavier slower boat. They have those boats for a reason. I have seen more people go away from the heavy kayaks like an Outback than the other way around.
The new Hobie Outback -- a "wider" kayak-- is definitely NOT a dryer ride than a Hobie Revo. That nice concave deck of the Outback channels all the water that comes over the deck from waves to spray right into your chest in rough conditions. Whereas, a wave breaking over the bow of a Revo will rarely make it back to the cockpit. In fact, it rarely makes in past the front hatch. As for tracking, the predominant case among kayak designs will be a longer narrower kayak will track much better than a short wide one. Wider boats are not necessarily more stable. They may have better PRIMARY stability so people feel like they are more stable. However, a narrower boat will usually have better SECONDARY stability. In other words they are more like a log. When a wave hits them from the side, they do not roll as -- and potentially flip -- as easy as a wide boat with good primary stability. I will take my narrow kayak with better secondary stability out in rough conditions all day long over a wider kayak because in reality, it is more stable in rough conditions. Also, when the wide kayak with good primary stability gets flipped in the surf or ends up upside down in another way, it is much more difficult to get it flipped back around. They also hurt more when they land on your head. ;D
So, if you feel the need to carry a tackle shop with you and do not need to cover a lot ground with ease, a wider boat is probably your boat. If you do not need a lot of gear to catch fish, you like to cover ground in a hurry, and fish rough conditions or strong currents, then a narrower kayak is probably a better fit for you. That is the beauty of it. Lots of choices.
Or, buy one of each. The manufacturers and retail shops will appreciate it!
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I did buy one of each ;D but then turned right around after a trip or two in the outback and luckily for me the shop took the outback back and gave me another revo 13. the outback was too sluggish, i remember it seemed to push the water where as the revo cut ?thru.
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I agree with Craig.
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Well written Craig. I think you're on target with that explanation.
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Native came out with the Slayer Propel LT with a hull weight of around 62 pounds. I was keen on buying it but it just disappeared and from what little I know it was problem with the thermomolding of the hull. Very frustrating. Just keep pedaling my Slayer Propel 13 and waiting for the next lighter boat.
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I have seen more people go away from the heavy kayaks like an Outback than the other way around.
On my list of pedal kayaks, there are only two kayaks which weigh less than the Outback. So the Outback is actually pretty light for a pedal kayak.
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I went from a revo 16 to an Outback and and would never go back. Love all the storage, and the rectangular hatch is money. I can handle an 85 lb yak if it offers me this much storage for the combo trips; crab, salmon, bottom fish. I like good primary and secondary stability, the newer outback’s are really hard to flip, and on a drift out on the reef it is way more pleasant than a revo. For my needs, the newer outback’s bow design eliminates all the old complaints of hull slap, and moves along at a more than acceptable pace. Perhaps if I fished the puget sound or the Lower Columbia more I would miss the speed a bit, but I catch a shitload of fish in the open ocean.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3igA4GB97WE
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I have seen more people go away from the heavy kayaks like an Outback than the other way around.
On my list of pedal kayaks, there are only two kayaks which weigh less than the Outback. So the Outback is actually pretty light for a pedal kayak.
Hobie Compass, all the Revos still made, and the Passport models are lighter.
As others have said the demand for big stable boats for small water is higher than that for ocean trollers and the current crop of medium boats (i.e. the new Outback) seem to do a good job of balancing stability, capacity and speed. Also, I would have to guess the reinforcement needed to support the drive and the forces exerted on it adds up. I mean finding a 12'+ paddle SOT under 60 lbs isnt really that common, at least without going higher end.
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I'd also guess the main factor comes down to the extra rigidity and internal bracing required for the peddle drive and power poles. As others have mentioned, many of the models are bass boats designed for shallow, flat water, where stand up fishing and power pole usage is the intent.
I recently went over most of the top contenders myself and narrowed it down to a Hobie Compass (68 lbs w/o drive; $2.3-2.5k); Hobie Passport 12 (73 lbs w/o drive; $1.7k) and Old Town Sportsman Salty 120 (79 lbs w/o seat and drive; $1.9k).
Really liked the compass but couldn't justify the extra $600, seeing their shorter hull and drive warranty and the numerous scary Hobie hull crack threads. Ended up ordering a Salty, which shows up later this week. I car top, so weight is a major factor for me.