Blackmouth from kayak

T2, well, the jigs catch fish but I can’t say I’m a fan of the double short hook that comes with them.  Caught lots of shakers of coho and black mouth at shilshole I’m the butterflies. Have to admit I might not have given the 3oz Pt Wilson equal time, but I’d say the butterflies were ahead. That said one will immediately be converted to a single barbless siwash. Ended up keeping 2 small coho, 17+19 inches. I’m pretty sure it happened after the initial hookup each time, but the second hook made a “would have been fatal” 2nd hook up through an eye. On the 19 I watched it happen right at the boat. Otherwise I liked the jig. Did loose a few (shakers were all over) and have to wonder if the shape of the stockier style provided some leverage.  Something to consider.

I've switched one of the Shimano butterfly jigs to a single 4/0 siwash.  Right now there's lots of immature coho/blackmouth and the double hook increases bad hookups and I'm sure mortality.  Here's a picture and I'm hoping the single larger hook will reduce hooking smaller and provide an easier process to release them.  I've also found that a 2 foot leader with a backward snap swivel that connects to an O ring tied off to the mainline allows for very quick swaps.  To avoid tangles each jig gets it's own zip lock to avoid tangles. I really suggest mono about 10 lbs under the mainline, especially if you're using braid.  Untangling braid in any case is almost futile and with cold wet hands in ways, not so easy as on dry land.  You get a little bit of stretch which can really help as well.  Again, even without strong record keeping, I think the butterflies did outfish the darts, but who knows, I might have been working them harder.  We had a light tide and I could have dropped to 2 ounces.  I had more luck hooking up by going low, waiting for marks and then reeling up to the fish about as fast as I could with an direct drive knuckle buster:-0  Jason found that practice good and said the line counter he had was really nice.  There's no need to set the hook on that type of retrieve, just be handing on...even with smaller fish.
Please be aware the picture seems to be getting squeezed. In real life the jig is longer/more narrow.

I'll definitely be interested in the hookup results after the change to a single siwash hook. I really need to work on my jigging game. I only hooked up on a small portion of the bites that I got and I lost two fish for every one that I got to the kayak. I've been brainstorming today on jig and hook setups that might increase my hookup percentage and, more importantly to me, greatly increase the number of fish that I hook that I actually get to the kayak. I'm considering adding an assist hook on the front to help hookups or running the line through the top and bottom eyes on the jig with a bumper like on a buzz bomb to reduce lost fish. I think the two are mutually exclusive or I'd try them both.

Peddle kayaks cheat and are able to sustain pretty consistent speeds hands free while us paddle folks can't (couldn't help it, no offense, just jealousy).  As Jason mentioned, we trolled a bit looking for bait with one pole and were ready to drop jigs ASAP with another pole once we found some.  Tide, wind, current and if you're a paddler, the ability to chew gum and juggle all come into play. On my next trip I'm going to move away from traditional spoons/plugs and try this left over from a WI trip.  It's just over 6 inches and wiggles pretty good at even a slow speed, down to >1 MPH.  Just wondering if anyone has gone this route hunting for the winter blackmouth?  Three trebles from WI to 2 single siwash here...
For those who are allowed rockfish or even small halibut, if you're trolling low for blackmouth, it would seem this would work as a combo?

I've done zero blackmouth fishing thus far so clearly I haven't targeted them with such baits, but coming from bass fishing I have a ton of them at my disposal and have been thinking about how I can incorporate them into my salt/salmon fishing (and whether they are even viable or not).           

For those without downriggers, there is a rig I've seen done a lot on the lakes where you run a 3-way swivel off of the mainline, with a leader+weight hanging down and the minnow bait on a leader trailing back.  This will allow you to run your bait a lot deeper than it would normally dive and using a suspending or even floating bait can help keep your crank from hanging on the bottom.

I've also a ton of soft plastics, many which resemble candlefish to a T (laminate senkos for example anyone?).  The problem is how to get them and keep them in the strike zone of these guys...

Peddle kayaks cheat and are able to sustain pretty consistent speeds hands free while us paddle folks can't (couldn't help it, no offense, just jealousy).

Yep.. that jealousy is why I sold my previous kayak and now have the pedal kayak. It's nice to actually be able to fish the whole time that I'm kayak fishing. 



Thanks again for all the help on Sunday!

Great info. That double hook set up on the butterfly looked unappealing/dodgy to me, and the reported foul hooking/injuring fish that might get returned seals it. I did buy some of those single stinger hooks with the mini leader; may try those or at least one on the head when I (hopefully) get out this coming weekend.

Will hopefully have some useful actual feedback to report! Though did get a useful tip that was new to me from one of the guys at Outdoor Emporium when buying the gear, regarding jigging action on a kayak. He said he had successfully used a technique where once the jig was in position in the water column, using one hand as a fulcrum and the other hand would move the butt end of the rod up and down, kind of like a see-saw. Said he had had plenty of hook ups and it was a lot less tiresome/crampy. Looking forward to trying it.

Though did get a useful tip that was new to me from one of the guys at Outdoor Emporium when buying the gear, regarding jigging action on a kayak. He said he had successfully used a technique where once the jig was in position in the water column, using one hand as a fulcrum and the other hand would move the butt end of the rod up and down, kind of like a see-saw. Said he had had plenty of hook ups and it was a lot less tiresome/crampy. Looking forward to trying it.

I actually ended up doing that exact thing out of necessity once my computer engineer bicep refused to jig the normal way anymore. The guy who gave you the tip was right. It worked fine and was much less tiring.

Most tropical vertical jigging is done with a similar double-hook setup, but with the hooks above the body of the jig. They work amazingly well for tuna, mahi, and wahoo.

That shimano jig looks nice, especially around schools of herring. I've had a lot of luck with 3+" white darts whenever I've gone out this winter, but I'm not opposed to trying out another jig. Also, scent DEFINITELY helps in the winter still. Especially in drawing the keeper sized blackmouths. Without scent I haven't hooked one over 22". When I've added scent, it seems like on average I hook up with bigger ones.

Is it a secret scent:-)?  WD-40?  Shrimp oil? 

As for the double hook setup, I have to wonder if you have hits on either ends with a flat-falling fluttery jig vs more on the bottom with a dart that's more vertical?  I'm going to stick a siwash on each end and see how many times I can foul hook my line.

With the doubles on last weekend I had two small coho hooked through the back.  While it might have made good ling cod bait, I can't use them for salmon with that likely mortality rate, especially when the odds are good of small jacks

Though did get a useful tip that was new to me from one of the guys at Outdoor Emporium when buying the gear, regarding jigging action on a kayak. He said he had successfully used a technique where once the jig was in position in the water column, using one hand as a fulcrum and the other hand would move the butt end of the rod up and down, kind of like a see-saw. Said he had had plenty of hook ups and it was a lot less tiresome/crampy. Looking forward to trying it.

I actually ended up doing that exact thing out of necessity once my computer engineer bicep refused to jig the normal way anymore. The guy who gave you the tip was right. It worked fine and was much less tiring.

I have used this method on boats when going deep with big jigs (16+ ounces). Keeps you jigging longer. Only downside is you can't reel immediately when you feel a bump. You can also decrease the effort of jigging when using the "tip lift" method by putting a little weight at the butt of the rod. Also a shorter rod makes a difference.

Is it a secret scent:-)?  WD-40?  Shrimp oil? 

As for the double hook setup, I have to wonder if you have hits on either ends with a flat-falling fluttery jig vs more on the bottom with a dart that's more vertical?  I'm going to stick a siwash on each end and see how many times I can foul hook my line.

With the doubles on last weekend I had two small coho hooked through the back.  While it might have made good ling cod bait, I can't use them for salmon with that likely mortality rate, especially when the odds are good of small jacks

hehe.. I would go with whatever scent you prefer to be honest. I've got a go to, but I haven't tested changing out different scents.

Got out Saturday morning early Lincoln Park area, and Sunday for a 5+ hour session at Golden Gardens. Had some success and wanted to make a shout out to all as the advice in this thread was useful and effective. Now have a starting point for both winter blackmouth and jigging for salmon.

Used the shimano butterfly only Saturday. Went 10-30' up off of the bottom. Used the fulcrum technique, scent on the jig (salted herring sj). Put a siwash on the bottom of the jig and a stinger hook slung on the top of the jig. Quiet, foggy morning; enjoyed a slow drift and working the jig. For a while all I attracted was squid (3, see pic) and bottom fish, then at the end of the session got a nice strike and brought in a 19" blackmouth. Great start to the day and fun to get on salmon again.

Sunday hit Golden Gardens 8-1:30. Cold start turned into a warm, sunny day and a more thorough session. Started with the butterfly jig and crossed some bait on the way to the green can and hooked up with a cutthroat, then caught two salmon (both 19-20") on the butterfly. Shifted over to trolling with a flasher and a larger coyote cop car spoon, and hooked up with a nice fish that was giving more fight. Then, suddenly a lot more fight. For the next 30 minutes I had a pre-holiday sleigh ride thanks to a seal that had been dogging me all morning. I was amazed my 20# mono didn't give, but I kept workin the drag and retrieve hoping if would just bite off a chunk and I'd get my tackle back. Each time it came up for air it would look at me with the keeper salmon held across its mouth, looking like a dog with a bone. I finally cut the line.

Switched back to the butterfly, quickly picked up another salmon. And just as quickly the line suddenly picked up speed and direction and I was on my way to another tackle donation.

Rounded out the day with some more jigging using a couple of sizes of white point Wilson darts and got another short, another that may have been just legal right to the kayak, a couple of more cutthroats, and 3 solid (and bigger) hookups as well as a bunch of bumps. All of the post-seal encounter hookups suffered due to the fact that I was horsing the fish in to beat the seals that were constant companions.

No keepers but great times on the water. A few personal takeaways:
- Both jigs used had a good bit of success throughout the days. Will be reloading on those
- Several hookups to the stinger hooks on the head of the jigs
- The two hooks did result in a couple of nastier foul or second hookings
- Only a couple of boats out, so for the seals we were the only game in town. Pretty challenging, and costly!
- The fulcrum type method worked great, both for energy conservation and ability to convert a strike
- That zone 10-30' off the bottom was productive. Usually in 50-100 FOW. Often caught on transitions too (shifts of depth after having been at one for a bit)
- Working with the current charts from Trident13 was a nice evolution. Less paddling, more fishing
- No bait seen in WS, saw a good bit through the day at GG. All visual and birds only as I still don't have a fish finder. Last couple of forays in WS have not seen bait

I'm psyched for more winter salmon- now need to find some big ones! Thanks to all for sharing advice and tips.

Shifted over to trolling with a flasher and a larger coyote cop car spoon, and hooked up with a nice fish that was giving more fight. Then, suddenly a lot more fight. For the next 30 minutes I had a pre-holiday sleigh ride thanks to a seal that had been dogging me all morning.

If at first you don't succeed, just get an even larger (livelier) coyote cop car spoon and start writing tickets.   

Smoke

I've also a ton of soft plastics, many which resemble candlefish to a T (laminate senkos for example anyone?).  The problem is how to get them and keep them in the strike zone of these guys...

 I’ve been thinking about your note for a few days. We’ll be traveling thru the holidays, but I’d buy a brew or two to see some examples of soft plastic candle fish.  Whether it’s a fish and breakfast or evening brew meetup I’d sure like to see one after the 1rst some time. Raven knows some good spots, maybe him, Jason and some other new folks from the north end.

Showa posted a note about crappie type fishing and the chance of a Seattle area crappie shoot out, maybe combine the two issues.