Shrimping out of a kayak-problems

So AFTER I commit to a plan you guys chime in?!?!  Lol.  Just kidding.  All very good point and even more reason to heed ZEE's advice about keeping it temporary until some trials.

During the initial build I had thought about using the Downrigger boom as my stabilizer arm.  But I figured basically for all the work, it would be making a 33.5 inch kayak into a 40 inch wide kayak for a lot of work and some money.  Maybe that extra 6 inches is all I needed?   I had the bits and pieces to take it from a 33.5 inch wide kayak to a kayak that’s 10 feet wide (if I wanted.)  I did reinforce the velcro after  some concerns were raised.  I can say that with a steady pull by hand on the outrigger, I can start to hear the Velcro separate, but I couldn’t get it to fully come off.  It didn’t even budge when I would jerk on the outrigger.  I think the pole will bend before the Velcro comes off now.

I thought about pulling the pots up close as possible to the center line.  But now that I have a stable outrigger, I think there are benefits to it being out farther.  I can always rotate the arm closer.  I have run over the scenario over and over again in my mind, and barring something crazy happening, the biggest problem I have dreamed up so far is if the wind and current conditions were just right that as I am pulling the pots up, the kayak orients its way in such a manner that the pots are always under or on the wrong side of the kayak.  I know from experience that the spectra line might as well be superheated hot razor wire if it is rubbing up against anything plastic as it is being pulled in.  If we are drifting correctly, the boom reaches almost to the very back of the kayak so I will be able to pull it close to the kayak and even better, closer to the centerline directly at the back of the craft. 

Why the swivel mount?  I ran over as many different methods as I could think of to efficiently transfer the line on and off the downrigger to the pots and/or buoys.  Keep in mind I plan to have up to 5 shots of line on the downrigger.  This allows me to fish 5 pots and different depths.  Typically I think my line lengths are going to be in 150 yards and 200 yard increments to let me effectively fish 350 to 500 ft down.  I couldn’t find any connecting mechanism that was strong enough and yet small enough to fit through the downrigger guides and the pulley.  The best I could find was a 40 lbs rated micro snap swivel.  It sure looks flimsy compared to the 100 pound spectra line. 
So with that being said, there was no way I could satisfactorily come up with where I could just clip the line after its out of the downrigger onto a snap or whatever that is strong enough and that could then just be pulled up through the guides then pulley. So that means at some point I need to thread line into the downrigger and make the connection.  I can’t do that if the pulley is out any distance from the kayak.   I may still use the 40 lbs test micro swivel since I can’t imagine their being more pull than that but it just seems so dang flimsy compared to everything else.  It’s a premium swivel too.  This is a work in progress for sure. 

I also use spectra line a lot.  Can you imagine having to fix every time you tangled the tip of your rod without bringing the rod tip to you?  Ya sure, 90 percent of the time just turn the rod in one direction and the tangle is done.  But the other 10%, it’s looped around an eye, or anything it possible can wrap around.  I want to be able to pull the tip in and fix it.  This is more of a convenience thing as I could remove the downrigger from the base to bring the tip in but the rotating base seemed like the perfect answer…until it arrived and it was so dang HUGE!

I also had some people ask about the weight issue.  Kayak is rated for 325.  I figure everything I added including the pots contributes 50 pounds so far.  I weigh 200 with drysuit and gear.  So that gives me 75 pounds or nearly 25% cushion in the weight area.

Ok, sorry if some of the answers seem disconnected. I typed up the reply during lunch hour.  Sorry for the distractions but the opener is now 10 hours out!!!!!  Though I probably won't go until tomorrow evening or Sat Morning.  Even if I catch enough for one meal, this will be great.  Even if I don't catch anything this time, but the deployment is a success, then I know to hitch a ride out to prime waters from a power boating friend instead of trying it close to launch.  Hope to be able to report sometime this weekend!

A typical crab pot buoy offers 7 pound of lift.  If you're not expecting to pull up much more weight than that, then having one or two near the tip should be sufficient.

It's not just about having the end close to the centerline.  It's also about having the base on the other side of the center line.  Think of a teeter totter.  Having the base on the other side acts as a counter-balance.

Where you have it now doesn't seem like too much of a stretch to necessitate a swivel mount.  But I have long arms to everything seems close to me!   

-Allen

Wow.  If I Could do without the oturiggers that'd sure be nice.  I have my buoys attached in such a way that I was thinking that maybe I could slip my feet into the rope and use my legs as the "arm".  I guess just straddle the kayak with the buoy as "shoes"...hmmm....

I was contemplating this type of system initially.  I'd cut the pvc pipe above the downrigger of course.


Well I think the most permanent modification was using the adhesive that came with the velcro straps to attach it to my kayak.  Everything else is temporary so keep the ideas coming. 

Thanks again everyone.  Couldn't of even attempted this without everyones input.

Turn the buoy(s) parallel to the yak and also have it act as your bumper so the spectra doesn't rub up against the yak.  Bring it all in as close as you can.

-Allen

Turn the buoy(s) parallel to the yak and also have it act as your bumper so the spectra doesn't rub up against the yak.  Bring it all in as close as you can.

-Allen

The buoy doubling as the bumper.  Brilliant.  So the plan since I am somewhat committed to the current setup will be to try pulling up the pots with the outrigger arm at various lengths to see how much I "need" out there. I'll also get a feel for any unforseen advantages or disadvantages of the various positions.

I won't be able to crank, but I can still see potential effects of hanging pots on the side opposite the downrigger since currently the arm reaches.  That's the other limiting factor is where the handle is so I can get a decent angle to crank on the handle. Best is to have the downrigger facing directly away from you with rotation clockwise slightly ok. 

here's some low res pics to show the possible positions from current mount.  Dead center might be okay if the final solution has a bumper to protect against the line.  The arm position in the second picture is the easiest to crank up.

Ok...last post until i try it...I hope (and you guys probably too!). Maybe one more as I pack it up with all the gear to see what it looks like.

Here are the finishing touches.

The most permanent thing I did was to use velcro that had adhesives and put a few inches onto my kayak.  Other than that, no holes, nothing permanent.

It is ROCK solid.  I think it's going to work,  Now its up to the operator.

I used hooks to hold the two sides of the board down a la the cobra anchor build.  The board was too thin so I drilled a hole in the top of a PVC pipe cap and added a washer and wingnut for space.  The front is just wedged in and held in place by the bungie cords.  Screwed the two pieces of wood together and VOILA! I will say I had vision of breaking it down and assembling on water but no chance.  I'm just going to have to be careful about the weight of the downrigger slightly off to the side and high.

My goal is 6 shrimp per pot per pull.  Fairly modest.  We will see.  After some research, the tactic I plan to employ is to drop pots in the deeper end of the range of my lines during the day  2 to 3 hour soaks maximum as I prospect for spot shrimp.  The shrimp apparently come shallower at night to feed so try to find the best place and drop one fairly deep, one maybe more in the 300 ft range for an over night soak.  Once I have the system down and IF it works, I will invest in three more pots and just run them like a trap line if I want shrimp.  if not, they all stay down for overnight soaks or longer while I fish.  Just depends on how well this system works and how good the "other' fishing is. 

After all of this and all of your help. I sure hope I have something good to report.  I;d be happy if the system worked but I didn't catch anything.  I know where there are shrimp.  It's just going to have to wait until I can hitch a ride on a power boat. 

Nice build K, can't wait to see some results. I'm thinking just have the rigger on the one board sit side saddle, sit on the long end of board and crank away. Use a picking hook to grab 'tween the shots..

Yes, I know my brilliance is underwelming..

Two pots down. No problem deploying. Pulling them will be another issue!!!!

Details later. Too windy and a bit choppy to deal with filming this time. Concept works fine. Took twice as long I think to reel in line but I was tired from paddling against the wind. 90 minute short soak. 2 spots, a coon, and I think humpy. Be back to pull again tomorrow weather permitting.

Nice shrimp! So- do you have two pots soaking overnight?  They hopefully will be reaaaally heavy tomorrow.
-Scott

Yup. Two pots soaking. I just pulled one pot. Tunnel closes at ten pm. My bed is way more comfy then my civic.  Hope weather is a bit better. Wasn't too bad. Just out of shape!!!

I would call that a success! and yummy!

Holy cow! This boy is out of shape!  So the weather was nice but a little windier than I liked blowing 8-10mph gusting to 15 mph.  Spent most of the time on the water paddling against the wind.  I'd position then by the time I was ready to go, I would have drifted a 100 yards and I'd have to paddle back upwind again since there was another shrimp pot 150 to 200 yards away I wanted to stay away from.

I think several things were unexpected.  The biggest think I noticed was how slow the pots drop.  I guess I would have thought the line would be flying off the downrigger but it just kind of lazily turned while the pot fell.  I tried to paddle slowly upwind so that the line wasn't at a big angle as it was dropping.  Dropped one at 350 initially and 300 ft.  I pulled the one at 350 ft after a 90 minute soak and you saw the results.  If I was more experience I bet I could do it WITHOUT an outrigger.  But switching positions so often I felt safer.  The velcro adhesive to the kayak came off.  The velcro on the rings I think are fine but long term I would beef it up.  I had one time when the outrigger arm slid in and the reason i noticed was the kayak felt tippier all the sudden so the outrigger was at least holding the kayak level.

The other thing was that it was twice as hard to reel in the line than I expected.  But i think a lot of that was due to paddling for a couple of hours and the half a dozen times I repositioned to drop pots due to the wind.  Somebody in better shape could do it no problem.  It wasn't too hard to crank, it just took longer than the dry run.  There is no way I would try this with a reel though.  Until I am in better shape, I think one pull in the morning, and one at night and I swill stick to two pots, maybe three. 

When pulling it up, I could have the boom pointed pretty much straight backwards.  So I didn't feel tippy at all, but I can't say how much was the outriggers.  With the wind and chop, I just wanted to get it done.  Will analyze more as I continue to develop the technique.  Hopefully a little video as well when I pull tomorrow.

As is often the case, the only time the wind calmed down was when I paddled to shore for break.  Beautiful scenery!  Too bad I didn't enjoy as I was too focused on staying alive!  lol.  I am sure it will get easier but not bad for a first effort I think!!!!!
 

Are you allowed to use electric for power winching? 

Or maybe build a pedal system that allows you to crank the pots up by foot?

Are you allowed to use electric for power winching? 

Or maybe build a pedal system that allows you to crank the pots up by foot?

Insayn, you are on to something.  I do have a 12v plug on my kayak tied into my sonar battery.  I could add more.  My initial thought was to buy an electric reel.  Electric Downriggers are too big.  But that's more than double the value of my kayak!  I guess I used to buy $20 video games and then a $500 video card to play them on. 

The pedal thing is SUPER intriguing.  How sweet would that be.  A lot more engineering and thought but if the Hobie can power a kayak with fins, I can't see why you could turn something!  Maybe that's a good reason for me to upgrade to a revolution or outback I am eyeing up.  Swap drives and go.  Though the hands free thrust of hobies has its own appeal in this sceanrio.

Well gotta head out.  Forecast is getting worse. West 15mph.  Dead calm now but will pick up in the afternoon.  Better get the gear!