Personal use herring

I would guess that money PEW collects  towards saving baitfish might be used towards other ends.  Just like how certain organizations collect money to save domestic cats, then pay lawyers to sew the state to save fucking sea lions

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Sorry in advance for thread jacking but I should note one thing about PEW. The particular project Dino is talking about is trying to protect currently unmanaged, unfished stocks of forage fish: sauries for instance. Protecting these fish does not hurt fisherman and only helps the predatory fish stocks i.e. salmon...

I am not familiar with all the details of MPA proposals so I don't want to get into that but this particular project seems like a win-win for everyone involved.

Herring are already managed so they are not relevant to PEWs forage fish project.

Ummm ... the very first paragraph in the intro to that site states:

A thriving ocean ecosystem relies on plenty of oil-rich forage fish such as sardines, anchovies and herring. These small schooling fish occupy the crucial midpoint of the ocean food web and are preyed upon by many species of seabirds, marine mammals and commercially and recreationally important fish such as salmon, tuna, groundfish and other predators.

Those forage fish mentioned are ALL managed fisheries.

-Allen

Sorry in advance for thread jacking but I should note one thing about PEW. The particular project Dino is talking about is trying to protect currently unmanaged, unfished stocks of forage fish: sauries for instance. Protecting these fish does not hurt fisherman and only helps the predatory fish stocks i.e. salmon...

I am not familiar with all the details of MPA proposals so I don't want to get into that but this particular project seems like a win-win for everyone involved.

Herring are already managed so they are not relevant to PEWs forage fish project.

Ummm ... the very first paragraph in the intro to that site states:

A thriving ocean ecosystem relies on plenty of oil-rich forage fish such as sardines, anchovies and herring. These small schooling fish occupy the crucial midpoint of the ocean food web and are preyed upon by many species of seabirds, marine mammals and commercially and recreationally important fish such as salmon, tuna, groundfish and other predators.

Those forage fish mentioned are ALL managed fisheries.

-Allen

The plan's first tangible initiative would extend management protection to currently unfished forage species -- such as saury, sandlance and certain kinds of smelts -- before another industrial-scale fishery starts up.

http://www.pewenvironment.org/news-room/opinions/for-healthy-salmon-protect-forage-fish-85899466262

For the record I don't particularly support Pew. For instance the link has misleading info about sardines. They don't mention the change in oceanic conditions and implying the the collapse of the stock was due to fishing instead of something like:

This collapse wasn’t just because of fishing pressure – scientists now recognize that there was also a change in oceanic cycles, which resulted in an extended period of below-normal water temperatures. Sardines are generally more abundant during a warm water regime, so the colder water greatly influenced the decline in sardine abundance.

http://www.fishwatch.gov/seafood_profiles/species/sardine/species_pages/pacific_sardine.htm

What's wrong with feeding your dog some of these fish?  My dog requires a fish based food (with no grains) as other protien sources, not to mention the grain fillers in other types of dog food, tear her GI tract apart and also give her really bad skin problems.  Until we switched to the fish based food we were spending ungodly amounts each year at the vet.  As expensive as her food is (I swear it would be cheaper to feed her people food) it's still far less expensive than all the vet visits.  She's quite healthy with what we feed her now.  I doubt she'd have even lived to 9 or 10 (she's 11 now) if we had stuck with non-fish based foods.

In response to michagee, I don't consider this discussion thread jacking at all.

While I thought more of the conversation would lead to how I'm going to get a pissed off seal out of my net, this obviously involves a discussion around forage fish.

I'm too PC sometimes. But I think it's good to discuss this. If this thread had turned into me getting flamed...I mean educated, that my actions might somehow be detrimental beyond any positives, I'd probably have moved on to something crazier like brown bear bow hunting off my kayak given the caliber of folks commenting on here.

All good stuff!!!


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Sorry in advance for thread jacking but I should note one thing about PEW. The particular project Dino is talking about is trying to protect currently unmanaged, unfished stocks of forage fish: sauries for instance. Protecting these fish does not hurt fisherman and only helps the predatory fish stocks i.e. salmon...

I am not familiar with all the details of MPA proposals so I don't want to get into that but this particular project seems like a win-win for everyone involved.

Herring are already managed so they are not relevant to PEWs forage fish project.

Ummm ... the very first paragraph in the intro to that site states:

A thriving ocean ecosystem relies on plenty of oil-rich forage fish such as sardines, anchovies and herring. These small schooling fish occupy the crucial midpoint of the ocean food web and are preyed upon by many species of seabirds, marine mammals and commercially and recreationally important fish such as salmon, tuna, groundfish and other predators.

Those forage fish mentioned are ALL managed fisheries.

-Allen

The plan's first tangible initiative would extend management protection to currently unfished forage species -- such as saury, sandlance and certain kinds of smelts -- before another industrial-scale fishery starts up.

http://www.pewenvironment.org/news-room/opinions/for-healthy-salmon-protect-forage-fish-85899466262

For the record I don't particularly support Pew. For instance the link has misleading info about sardines. They don't mention the change in oceanic conditions and implying the the collapse of the stock was due to fishing instead of something like:

This collapse wasn’t just because of fishing pressure – scientists now recognize that there was also a change in oceanic cycles, which resulted in an extended period of below-normal water temperatures. Sardines are generally more abundant during a warm water regime, so the colder water greatly influenced the decline in sardine abundance.

http://www.fishwatch.gov/seafood_profiles/species/sardine/species_pages/pacific_sardine.htm

Got it.  And I'm glad you recognize some of the "deception".

BTW  ... Dino, why were they at a Sportsman show?  I don't think that we as sportsmen, all of us on the west coast, use more forage fish for personal consumption or bait, that one set of a commercial seiner.  Just guessing here.  But it does leave me curious as to why they are targeting us.  Perhaps to play on our emotions and turn us against commercial fishermen.  I sound crazy when I type shit like that ... where's my tinfoil hat?   

-Allen

Hey If your going to do this Herring thing Kardinal let me know. Ill buy some gear too and try it out with Ya! I need you to tell me what to get though and where

Ok Matt!

I'm still nursing a flu but here's what I'm thinking.

Starting last week of April or first week of May I plan to try it.

All fishing will be close to shore. So plan on rigging a 20ft hill net standard depth which I can't recall.

If I sonar bait close. I plan to just drift close to shore. Shuttle fish in to colors and ice on land if I hit the mother load.

Another possibility is if there is two of us that once we done fishing, if the bait are in, one guy holds the shore line and one kayak acts as the outer buoy. The downside if this method is we will need a ton if rope.

I plan to run maybe 20 ft of rope plus buoy on each side of the net. Then to harvest the herring, I plan to just work the net over my lap and Pitch it off the other side as I am picking.

If I got serious, the only additional prep to the kayak would be to duct tape off all my rid holder mounts and such that would grab the net.

He'll if they are easy it maybe just towing the net around and tieing the whole thing back to shore to pick.

I have no clue... Never done it. But I guess that's the whole point. Not as much fun, but in experiments line these, a quick lesson that it can NOT be fine is almost as good as figuring it out and it working well. If it doesn't work, I can stop day dreaming about it.


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Do we need a permit?

If I don't have my kids I can drag the AI out and it can hold a couple coolers for you guys. Then you're not shuttling to the beach and back.

No permit, Just a sport license.

Haha with the AI out there it's going to look like a commercial operation!

My dad tells me he has an old net. Hmm... 

2 inch max mesh. I was going to run a tad smaller.

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Speaking of herring, I was at my favorite bait/grocery store, H-Mart and saw a 4 pound box of threadfin herring that appeared to be in better condition than the regular herring at the local sporting good store.  Has anybody ever used them for salmon? They are roughly the same size, buy fatter.