Buddy system

What kind of "buddy system" is practiced out there, especially in the salt?

Is there a BKM (Best Known Method) that everyone adheres to?

While ATV'ing we have a system to keep everyone safe and we don't drift too far from these rules.

 1. We designate a leader for the day, or for each trail before we start rolling.   
     Everyone has to acknowledge who that lead is, so there is no confusion.He 
     also carries the trail maps.   
 2. The lead makes the decisions on which way, how to, why or when to turn
     back based on the trail conditions.  The lead will take all riders skills, ATV and
     input into consideration before continuing on. 
 3. Helmets are required, and headlights turned on at all times while riding.
 4. At intersections, difficult sections, and or trail splits, everyone waits until the 
     next rider has made it through that section before they can continue
     themselves.  This gives the next rider clear instruction as to which way to 
     go, or to receive aide in making it through a difficult section.
 5. If the lead, and or any group has to wait more than two minutes at stop 
     point, we each back track and look for the hold up.  It could be as simple as   
     a breakdown, or stuck, but also be as bad as a crash, etc..  We don't leave
     anyone behind.


Now for kayaking, is there any BKM procedure(s) in place that anyone here uses while fishing together in potentially dangerous waters?   

If not, should we come up with something?

What kind of "buddy system" is practiced out there, especially in the salt?

Is there a BKM (Best Known Method) that everyone adheres to?

While ATV'ing we have a system to keep everyone safe and we don't drift too far from these rules.

 1. We designate a leader for the day, or for each trail before we start rolling.   
     Everyone has to acknowledge who that lead is, so there is no confusion.He 
     also carries the trail maps.   
 2. The lead makes the decisions on which way, how to, why or when to turn
     back based on the trail conditions.  The lead will take all riders skills, ATV and
     input into consideration before continuing on. 
 3. Helmets are required, and headlights turned on at all times while riding.
 4. At intersections, difficult sections, and or trail splits, everyone waits until the 
     next rider has made it through that section before they can continue
     themselves.  This gives the next rider clear instruction as to which way to 
     go, or to receive aide in making it through a difficult section.
 5. If the lead, and or any group has to wait more than two minutes at stop 
     point, we each back track and look for the hold up.  It could be as simple as   
     a breakdown, or stuck, but also be as bad as a crash, etc..  We don't leave
     anyone behind.


Now for kayaking, is there any BKM procedure(s) in place that anyone here uses while fishing together in potentially dangerous waters?   

If not, should we come up with something?

What kind of ATV do you ride? I have an '06 Yamaha Grizzly. Poor thing has been kinda lonely since i got my Yak. Good riding plan.

We don't have any hard fast rules when on the big blue, just keep an eye out for each other and make sure we tell someone if we are going in or to a different area alone.

I paddle out with my VHF set to 69 and carry my cell.  If a buddy calls from nearby, I fish with him.

That's my buddy system.  Similar to the Oregon surfing buddy system.

Probably not recomended for salt newbees....  



 

IMO, a buddy system can't hurt if you don't rely on it.  Often times when Zee and I are out, we might be a 1/4 mile apart or a lot more.  It might as well be one of us on the beach as a lot can happen by the time your buddy gets to you.  Self sufficiency is a good thing.

But a buddy system can be good ... as witnessed by Jay's story apres Pac City derby.

-Allen

NO...  IMO..two rules need  apply..  If fishing with others, keep an eye on your mates and the ocean..  If by yourself just keep an eye on the ocean ( Short of the PC tourny I have rarely fished with a buddy in 4 yrs of ocean yak fishing so I might be biased )..

I don't want to sound callous or like a jerk.. If a guy needs help I'll toss my rod in the drink and paddle my guts out to help, but I'm nobody's nurse..  It is good practice to keep an eye on your buddies (ala head count/VHF check every once and a while). But past that you are on your own.

I like the individuality of yak fishing. The concept that I am responsible for every single thing on my little piece of plastic is part of what really excites me about fishing in the ocean. I must be totally self sufficient for my well being, safety and enjoyment and I expect the others I may fish with to do the same.

What kind of ATV do you ride? I have an '06 Yamaha Grizzly. Poor thing has been kinda lonely since i got my Yak. Good riding plan.

I ride the red/white '86 Honda TRX250R and the blue '08 Yamaha Grizzly 700. 
The wife rides the blue/yellow '95 Yamaha Warrior 350, and the purple '97 Polaris Scrambler 500. 
The kids have the two tiny ATV's.

Amen PP.  You don't sound like a jerk to me.  I've gotten into similar debates on the web on a number of occasions.  Even been accused of not willing to look out for others.  People have said they would not paddle with me because they didn't think I was safe for them.  Safe for them?  I always say to NOT rely on me.  If they think they need to then they shouldn't paddle with themselves because it is NOT safe for them.

But I back my words up with ... if you need to rely on me, I will be there for you whether I know you or not.  That's the rules of the ocean.  You gotta look out for others on the big blue ...

-Allen

PP and PP, I completely understand your logic.  I don't see your position as being a jerk at all.  The ocean is quick to kill, and you are definitely not out their to babysit.   On a yak you are responsible for your own safety not others.   

On land, and with as many folks that are out there trying to ban our ATV's, and close our riding areas, we have to go about it with a tip toe approach so we don't have incidents that would put our sport further in jeopardy.

What you said totally applied when I fished the ocean in my PB.  I was responsible for my crew and thus had a different set of parameters to consider when it came to others enjoyment, comfort level and safety.

I agree with what you guys have said as well.  I think it really boils down to knowing yourself and your own capabilities.  When I taught wilderness survival I would always impress upon my students that the only person that you can absolutely trust with your life is yourself; if you aren't confident that you can fend for yourself if push comes to shove then you need to re-evaluate your situation and implement your exit strategy. 

Even when I am out with a group doing any outdoor activity I always act under the assumption that I may potentially be on my own.  I look out for the welfare of others and am sure they are doing the same, but I don't rely on them being there to make up for any of my own shortcomings.  I value life more than gear or a once in a lifetime fish, if you need help I will do whatever I can to help.

Shit happens; you should be ready to deal with it when (not if) it does.

I like the individuality of yak fishing. The concept that I am responsible for every single thing on my little piece of plastic is part of what really excites me about fishing in the ocean. I must be totally self sufficient for my well being, safety and enjoyment and I expect the others I may fish with to do the same.

I couldn't have said it better.  

If they think they need to then they shouldn't paddle with themselves because it is NOT safe for them.

But I back my words up with ... if you need to rely on me, I will be there for you whether I know you or not.  That's the rules of the ocean.  You gotta look out for others on the big blue ...

-Allen

I've never thought twice about swimming/paddling out into the maelstrom to rescue a stranger in trouble.  Even gone so far as to put a stranger on my surfboard and swim in behind them (a surf kayaker no less).  But, with the exception of people whom I am explicitly teaching ocean skills to, it's every man for him/herself.

Yes, everyone should be self sufficient and not dependent on others.  However, does that mean planning and coordinating is a bad thing?  I wouldn't expect anyone to risk their life for me, but does it hurt to agree to stick together, meet back at a certain time, or to check in on the radio occasionally.   If I say I'm going to be back to the beach by 5 pm and by 7 pm no one has seen or heard from me please do me a favor and call the coast guard.

Actually, by 7 pm one of you will have had a phone call from my wife asking where I am and she'll probably be calling the Coasties for me.

My experience would be there's no definite set of rules. On guided trips we follow a trip leader format and have more organized rules, but trying to apply that to less formal settings hasn't worked nearly as well. Different personalities, goals, and abilities, make it hard to get everyone on the same page. With fishing, the distances between boats makes it ever more of a challenge. Self-sufficiency is key but friends do come in handy sometimes. In groups I do my best to keep an eye on everyone, and will do anything I can to help. I've found the best thing for me in groups is to have one particular person I buddy up with & stay fairly close to. By doing this we keep an eye on each other if there's a problem, and can scoot over to help if needed.

On a side note, interesting that paddling solo is much more commonly accepted in the fishing side of things. In whitewater & sea kayaking that usually a very contentious subject, with the overwhelming majority being very much against it. I probably paddle more solo than with others, so I just quietly go about what I do. Nice to see someplace a little more realistic on the subject.

I do much more solo boating, than group outings, or I wouldn't be going. Just not that many partners over here, or when I travel. I have always believed in the importance of self-reliance and rescue. I sure am glad that my wife doesn't worry about me, as much as Brian's seems to worry about him.

I do enjoy the social aspect of group outings, and in those situations I'll watch out for others. Pairing up has worked pretty well for me, too. Trying to stay connected with everybody, in a larger group, can be a logistical nightmare, unless everybody has radios. I will caution about over-relying on groups for safety. While it can feel better and safer, it's not necessarily so. A group is only as strong as it's weakest member. I've read too many accounts of a weak member (or two) getting in to trouble, and leading to problems for the whole group. It's imperative that each participant know their own abilities, and be willing to accept the liabilities of those abilities. Being a member of a group means also accepting the liabilities of the weakest members, too.