Suiting up for Ocean Kayak Fishing

I will shortly be living on the Washington coast and was wondering about suits, wet suits and dry suits. I went back to my old stomping grounds in California and realized I had left my farmer john 5mm top/bottom diving suit down there, so I brought it back with me. Would that suit suffice for a beginner? to learn the ropes of cold water ocean kayak fishing? Since dry suits seem to cost you an arm and leg. Any and all input would be greatly appreciated.

Daniel

It may work to well .  When I started I used a full wetsuit (3mm) and found I cooked in it on hot days. Plus without a shell over the top I got a little chilled on windy days after I had I got the suit wet going out though the surf.  You might be better off picking up a cheap set (around $70 bucks at places like Bi Mart) of stocking foot neoprene waders, add a waist belt and a inexpensive splash/dry top and you have a very safe and versatile "system" for less than 150$ total

You might be better off picking up a cheap set (around $70 bucks at places like Bi Mart) of stocking foot neoprene waders, add a waist belt and a inexpensive splash/dry top and you have a very safe and versatile "system" for less than 150$ total

Yeah, that ^^

Next Adventure in PDX has brand new PAlm drysuits with neoprene neck gasket, booties and socks for $299!!!  Absolutely can't beat that deal.  They had 3 when i was there last Weds.

OOops-0--I meant with dry sox and relief zipper.  Still shakin from the Seahawk's game yesterday---the run by Lynch was the best I've ever seen!!!

OOops-0--I meant with dry sox and relief zipper.  Still shakin from the Seahawk's game yesterday---the run by Lynch was the best I've ever seen!!!

Yeah, that was unbelievable for sure!

I'm not speaking from any experience, but I'm still nervous about waders in the ocean.  Too much can happen too fast, and I wouldn't trust a belt to keep out enough water, especially if you're treading water for any amount of time.  On lakes, I can see waders and use them myself, but I'm still nervous.  In the summer, I'm quite comfortable in a 3/2 wetsuit, and in the spring, fall or winter, or cloudy days, I'm in a 5/4.  Warm, but not uncomfortable, and I know I can survive and swim in one for a long time.  A dry suit would be great too, but I don't have that experience either.

I'm not speaking from any experience, but I'm still nervous about waders in the ocean.  Too much can happen too fast, and I wouldn't trust a belt to keep out enough water, especially if you're treading water for any amount of time. 

Actually, I would not be too worried. I've played in the surf at Pacific City in February for a couple of hours in neoprene waders and a splash top. What little water that did get in warmed quickly like a wet suit and there is not much circulation. In fact, you could think of neoprene waders like a loose fitting farmer john. I would not advise doing that in breathable waders though as they won't provide any insulation once the water gets inside.

IMO the worst part about waders is that your ability to cover distance swimming is greatly reduced when your flooded even half way up your calves. With my breathable waders, once you get back on the kayak you can stretch the ankle gasket and drain the water out. I think with stocking foot neoprene waders you would be pretty much stuck with however much water floods in until you get back to shore and can disrobe. I do know a gallon or so down each leg makes it very difficult to kick effectively.

I use the neoprene wader/splash top combo and like it well enough. Haven't spent alot of time in the water but with a decent splash top or especially a dry top you don't fet much, if any water inside the waders.

In summer it is a bit hot, that's when i switch to shorts...

Get the Kokatat Tropos kayaker's dry suit, you'll be prepared for anything-- the suit is fantastic and about 1/2 the price of the Gore-tex suits, with a more comfortable neck than the latex strangler gasket.  You'll have warm and dry feet, there's a relief zipper for pit stops.  Waders/dry top a cheap option, but not nearly as good.  Why not (as they say at Filson) have the best?   

from the Kayak Academy in Issaquah, good folks:

There's only one non-Gore-Tex dry suit that we've found that worked nearly as well as a Gore-tex dry suit. It's the new Tropos fabric dry suit by Kokatat. Tropos is a new waterproof/breathable fabric that Kokatat developed and tested. In 2005 the introduced a suit made from Tropos called the SuperNova Paddling Suit. These suits have a thin neoprene Adjustable Punch Through (APT) neck rather than a true dry suit latex neck gasket. The APT neck doesn't seal water out as well as a latex neck gasket, but it is a lot more comfortable on your neck. So because of this neoprene neck, Kokatat calls these suits Paddling Suits rather than dry suits, but other than the APT neck, the suit is completely waterproof (the wrists do have latex gaskets same as any dry suit, and the suit comes standard with Tropos dry-socks). With the Super Nova Tropos Paddling Suit, you can stand in water up to your shoulders and not get a drop of water in. You can also paddle all day and only have a little bit of dampness from perspiration inside the suit.

For more information on these suits, click SuperNova Tropos Paddling Suit. Now that Tropos has proven itself for durability as well as waterproof/breathability, Kokatat is introducing two new full-on dry suits made from Tropos. The Tropos Meridian (TME) dry suit which features an overskirt for kayaking and front entry zipper will be available beginning December 2005, and the Tropos Swift Entry (TSE) Druid (a universal water-sports front-entry dry suit) will be available in mid-January 2006. We've already field tested prototypes of these new suits and can testify that they live up to Kokatat's high standards for waterproof integrity and are second only to Gore-tex (in our experience) for breathability. And Kokatat leak tests every one of these suits before they leave the factory. Maybe you'll never swim in your dry suit, maybe you'll never need to bivouac in it, maybe you'll never wear it as rain gear at camp, but isn't it nice to know you could? And now you don't have to sacrifice quality to save money on a non-Gore-Tex waterproof/breathable dry suit, check out the Kokatat Tropos dry suits available from the Kayak Academy.

I'll second what kallitype said.  The kokatat tropos suits are pretty sweet.  23 degrees, windy, rainy, colder than witch tits - not once you put that suit on.  Before I owned one I thought "they can't be that great".  I was wrong - they rock.  If you have the means to save up the 400 to 450, DO IT.

the suit is fantastic and about 1/2 the price of the Gore-tex suits, with a more comfortable neck than the latex strangler gasket.  You'll have warm and dry feet, there's a relief zipper for pit stops.

I've been using the NRS Tropos drysuit since 2006. It's the origin of the always entertaining (to everyone else) secret fish dance. Mine did not have the neoprene neck nor the relief zipper. Great suit and the only thing I've replaced is the neck gasket.

With the Super Nova Tropos Paddling Suit, you can stand in water up to your shoulders and not get a drop of water in. You can also paddle all day and only have a little bit of dampness from perspiration inside the suit.

 Maybe you'll never swim in your dry suit, maybe you'll never need to bivouac in it, maybe you'll never wear it as rain gear at camp, but isn't it nice to know you could?

Actually, I have had to do all of those things and the drysuit worked pretty darn well (see QCI trip)

That said, I think I still like the neoprene waders/ dry top for "everyday" use. I have not had to sleep in that combo, but it's managed pretty well for all of the other aforementioned activities.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing against the drysuit. If you have the bucks, go for it (and the Palm suit at Andy and Bax looks pretty darn sweet).  The only thing that I think is "wrong" with drysuits , is that they offer no insulation.  Without good underwear and/or a bunny suit they will still find your body frozen solid, but perfectly dry (kinda like a seal-a-meal)  
Throw in a bunny-suit (they ain't cheap*), the neoprene neck, and a relief zipper and that's, hands down, the best possible set of gear.

But because of the ease of use, cost, and built-in insulation the neoprene wader/drytop still gets my vote for a first (or second) yak fishing suit system.




*although one might be able to bribe SquidGirl to dress you like Ralphy for a good price

I wear the same insulation with my drysuit that I wore with my waders.  Fleec pants, MHR monkey-man fleece jacket, fleece hunting socks, and a beanie cap. 

I wear the same insulation with my drysuit that I wore with my waders.  Fleec pants, MHR monkey-man fleece jacket, fleece hunting socks, and a beanie cap. 

I did not mean to imply that you don't need good underwear with the neoprene* waders/dry top (heretofore Nw/dt). Especially under the top, that Monkey wrench gear looks like good stuff (had to look that one up).
 
But, I'd be willing to wade-ger (sorry) at least a quarter that you'd be more comfortable during and after swimming in the Nw/dt vs. the drysuit using the same underwear.
So there, the gauntlet is throw down. But I ain't the stuntman this time as the water is too warm here. 

The after swimming is the catchy point. I found I got a distinct chill from what I assume was evaporation as the outside of the drysuit dried after it was soaked.  I went in up to my neck to burp the air out of the suit and then it was continually re-wetted by the rain.

Actually, now that I think about it, I had on thinner underwear than your Monkey wrench and you'd probably be as comfortable even with the evaporation. I had on expedition weight army surplus polypro tops and bottoms (~$20 at Andy 'n Bax) and a thin polypro tee-shirt against my skin. That works great dry and in the water. They also made it MUCH easier to get in and out of my drysuit and reduced the fish dancing to a minimum.

So I guess that means I owe you a quarter and you didn't even have to wet your waders.

But, in my underwear in a drysuit, the bet would stand as the full chest coverage of the waders under the drytop don't suffer the evaporative losses of the drysuit. But then again, the evaporative losses of the back of the drysuit can be mitigated by the PFD. My back is uncovered because I use an inflatable PFD.
(I really hate when I argue both sides of my own argument)





*please especially note the NEOPRENE part of that neoprene waders combo. Breathable waders need not apply!